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Main
Date: 24 Sep 2006 01:28:34
From: vorange
Subject: Buying a bike
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I want to buy a bmx type of bike from walt. Visited walt to take
a look at what they have.
Narrowed it down to 2 bikes :
X-Cool 20"
http://tinyurl.com/oulcw
and
BMX Next Blitz 20"
http://tinyurl.com/oyfgv
Both are the same price. Has anyone ever ridden either and if so, what
is your opinion on it.
What is the difference really between a BMX and a mountain bike? When
I was young, I never heard of mountain bikes and they seem to have come
out of nowhere. To me they are just bmx bikes in a different form.
Also, how tall of a person is a 20" tire bicycle intended for? Any
other things I should know before buying the bike?
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Date: 27 Sep 2006 22:08:15
From: Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman
Subject: Re: Thread Drift (was: Buying a bike)
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Mr. Ed Dolan the Grate wrote:
> "Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1159236288.244903.261640@d34g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
> >
> > Frank Drackman wrote:
> >> "Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >> news:1159153299.011711.262790@m7g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
> >> >
> >> > Don Wiss wrote:
> >> >> Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> >Don Wiss wrote:
> >> >> >> "Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >Don Wiss wrote:
> >> >> >> >> On 24 Sep 2006 01:28:34 -0700, vorange <orangepic@yahoo.com>
> >> >> >> >> wrote:
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> >Also, how tall of a person is a 20" tire bicycle intended for?
> >> >> >> >> >Any
> >> >> >> >> >other things I should know before buying the bike?
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> To not damage your knees your leg should be almost straight on
> >> >> >> >> the
> >> >> >> >> down
> >> >> >> >> pedal. So for a normal adult male you'd need a pretty long seat
> >> >> >> >> post on a
> >> >> >> >> 20" bike.
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >My "20-inch" bike lacks a seat post and my leg is almost straight
> >> >> >> >out
> >> >> >> >at the "3 o'clock" position.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> But he is asking about a 20" tire bicycle. To which I am
> >> >> >> responding.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >I was referring to a bike that looks very much like this one: <
> >> >> >http://www.pedalkraft.de/_borders/Rocket_HR300.jpg>. Note the ISO
> >> >> >406-mm (20-inch decimal) size wheels.
> >> >>
> >> >> But the thread is about BMX bikes!
> >> >
> >> > I am countering an ingrained prejudice that bikes with small diameter
> >> > wheels are not to be taken seriously.
> >> >
> >> > --
> >>
> >> Nope, you are following your typical behavior. Trying to hijack a thread
> >> to
> >> make it all about you.
> >
> > Maybe I could change my name to Ed Dolan Jr. ;)
> >
> > Of course, instead of sniping, you could post something interesting
> > relevant to the thread.
>
> Mr. Sherman seldom posts anything of interest anymore. He has decided to
> become a master of trivia and to be as inconsequential as possible. It is
> probably because he has to write sensible stuff in the course of his job and
> so he thinks he can just slum on these cycling newsgroups. Mr. Sherman slums
> on trivia; Mr. Dolan slums on matters of great import.
I may be boring, but anyone who finds the Earth Cycles Sunset Lowracer
and/or Dragonflyer trike to be boring is a cretin of the lowest order.
--
Tom Sherman - Here, not there.
Red and Purple Earth Cycles Sunset Lowracers
Blue Earth Cycles Dragonflyer
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Date: 26 Sep 2006 17:10:14
From: Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
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Will wrote:
> Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman wrote:
>
> > You would be better off in the long run with an entry level hard-tail
> > or non-suspended (hard to find now) bike from a real bike store. Such
> > bikes can be found in the $400-600 dollars range. If that is too
> > expensive, real mountain bikes from the late 1980's to late 1990's are
> > plentiful on the used ket, and can often be found in decent
> > condition for less than $100.
>
> If I might add 2 cents here. The above is good advice. A quality used
> bicycle is a often the way to go. There's a lot of choice out there. I
> am partial to older, chromoly Treks and would suggest an early Trek
> "all-terrain" model 830, 850, 890, etc which is their older
> mountain/cross unit. But, depending on your tire selection, an aluminum
> frame in this cross/mountain genre can be quite comfortable as well.
>
> These bikes have excellent frame design and are easy to rack and
> fender. Any shop can work on them. You can work on them. It's not
> rocket science. Ebay is filled with good used parts. The frames are
> worth upgrading (within reason) if you get hooked....
I see a lot of the older steel frame (800 series, Antelope, etc.) Trek
ATB's in use by commuters. I suspect the good handling, durability, low
cost and low attractiveness to thieves are all factors.
--
Tom Sherman - Here, not there.
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Date: 26 Sep 2006 10:03:49
From: Will
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
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Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman wrote:
> You would be better off in the long run with an entry level hard-tail
> or non-suspended (hard to find now) bike from a real bike store. Such
> bikes can be found in the $400-600 dollars range. If that is too
> expensive, real mountain bikes from the late 1980's to late 1990's are
> plentiful on the used ket, and can often be found in decent
> condition for less than $100.
If I might add 2 cents here. The above is good advice. A quality used
bicycle is a often the way to go. There's a lot of choice out there. I
am partial to older, chromoly Treks and would suggest an early Trek
"all-terrain" model 830, 850, 890, etc which is their older
mountain/cross unit. But, depending on your tire selection, an aluminum
frame in this cross/mountain genre can be quite comfortable as well.
These bikes have excellent frame design and are easy to rack and
fender. Any shop can work on them. You can work on them. It's not
rocket science. Ebay is filled with good used parts. The frames are
worth upgrading (within reason) if you get hooked.
A Wal-t bike is a huge mistake. These bikes are cost engineered and
it shows. The wheels will never stay true, the seat will be sh*t in
several weeks, the brakes will squeak and chatter. The cables won't
adjust.
Do yourself a favor... get over to the library and get a book on
bicycle repair, one with lots of pictures. Once you understand basic
maintenance and sub-systems (brakes, drive train, etc...) you will be
better prepared to make a successful purchase.
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Date: 26 Sep 2006 19:07:58
From: Jeanne
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
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Will wrote:
> Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman wrote:
>
>
>>You would be better off in the long run with an entry level hard-tail
>>or non-suspended (hard to find now) bike from a real bike store. Such
>>bikes can be found in the $400-600 dollars range. If that is too
>>expensive, real mountain bikes from the late 1980's to late 1990's are
>>plentiful on the used ket, and can often be found in decent
>>condition for less than $100.
>
>
> If I might add 2 cents here. The above is good advice. A quality used
> bicycle is a often the way to go. There's a lot of choice out there. I
> am partial to older, chromoly Treks and would suggest an early Trek
> "all-terrain" model 830, 850, 890, etc which is their older
> mountain/cross unit. But, depending on your tire selection, an aluminum
> frame in this cross/mountain genre can be quite comfortable as well.
>
I have the Trek 930 from 1988 and it's been a great bike. I've taken it
to Hawaii and Baja California and Moab (although I basically walked Moab
instead of ride it). I strongly recommend any of the older Trek
mountain bikes from this period. My husband has the 850 and it's also
held up well. We ride them regularly when we bike with the kids (one of
us pulling a trail-a-bike).
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Date: 25 Sep 2006 19:04:48
From: Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman
Subject: Thread Drift (was: Buying a bike)
|
Frank Drackman wrote:
> "Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1159153299.011711.262790@m7g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
> >
> > Don Wiss wrote:
> >> Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> >Don Wiss wrote:
> >> >> "Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> >Don Wiss wrote:
> >> >> >> On 24 Sep 2006 01:28:34 -0700, vorange <orangepic@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >Also, how tall of a person is a 20" tire bicycle intended for?
> >> >> >> >Any
> >> >> >> >other things I should know before buying the bike?
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> To not damage your knees your leg should be almost straight on the
> >> >> >> down
> >> >> >> pedal. So for a normal adult male you'd need a pretty long seat
> >> >> >> post on a
> >> >> >> 20" bike.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >My "20-inch" bike lacks a seat post and my leg is almost straight out
> >> >> >at the "3 o'clock" position.
> >> >>
> >> >> But he is asking about a 20" tire bicycle. To which I am responding.
> >> >
> >> >I was referring to a bike that looks very much like this one: <
> >> >http://www.pedalkraft.de/_borders/Rocket_HR300.jpg>. Note the ISO
> >> >406-mm (20-inch decimal) size wheels.
> >>
> >> But the thread is about BMX bikes!
> >
> > I am countering an ingrained prejudice that bikes with small diameter
> > wheels are not to be taken seriously.
> >
> > --
>
> Nope, you are following your typical behavior. Trying to hijack a thread to
> make it all about you.
Maybe I could change my name to Ed Dolan Jr. ;)
Of course, instead of sniping, you could post something interesting
relevant to the thread.
--
Tom Sherman - Here, not there.
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Date: 27 Sep 2006 16:14:18
From: Edward Dolan
Subject: Re: Thread Drift (was: Buying a bike)
|
"Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:1159236288.244903.261640@d34g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
>
> Frank Drackman wrote:
>> "Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:1159153299.011711.262790@m7g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
>> >
>> > Don Wiss wrote:
>> >> Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >Don Wiss wrote:
>> >> >> "Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >Don Wiss wrote:
>> >> >> >> On 24 Sep 2006 01:28:34 -0700, vorange <orangepic@yahoo.com>
>> >> >> >> wrote:
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> >Also, how tall of a person is a 20" tire bicycle intended for?
>> >> >> >> >Any
>> >> >> >> >other things I should know before buying the bike?
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> To not damage your knees your leg should be almost straight on
>> >> >> >> the
>> >> >> >> down
>> >> >> >> pedal. So for a normal adult male you'd need a pretty long seat
>> >> >> >> post on a
>> >> >> >> 20" bike.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >My "20-inch" bike lacks a seat post and my leg is almost straight
>> >> >> >out
>> >> >> >at the "3 o'clock" position.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> But he is asking about a 20" tire bicycle. To which I am
>> >> >> responding.
>> >> >
>> >> >I was referring to a bike that looks very much like this one: <
>> >> >http://www.pedalkraft.de/_borders/Rocket_HR300.jpg>. Note the ISO
>> >> >406-mm (20-inch decimal) size wheels.
>> >>
>> >> But the thread is about BMX bikes!
>> >
>> > I am countering an ingrained prejudice that bikes with small diameter
>> > wheels are not to be taken seriously.
>> >
>> > --
>>
>> Nope, you are following your typical behavior. Trying to hijack a thread
>> to
>> make it all about you.
>
> Maybe I could change my name to Ed Dolan Jr. ;)
>
> Of course, instead of sniping, you could post something interesting
> relevant to the thread.
Mr. Sherman seldom posts anything of interest anymore. He has decided to
become a master of trivia and to be as inconsequential as possible. It is
probably because he has to write sensible stuff in the course of his job and
so he thinks he can just slum on these cycling newsgroups. Mr. Sherman slums
on trivia; Mr. Dolan slums on matters of great import.
Regards,
Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota
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Date: 25 Sep 2006 20:54:24
From: Werehatrack
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
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On 24 Sep 2006 01:28:34 -0700, "vorange" <orangepic@yahoo.com > wrote:
>I want to buy a bmx type of bike from walt. Visited walt to take
>a look at what they have.
>
>Narrowed it down to 2 bikes :
>
>X-Cool 20"
>http://tinyurl.com/oulcw
>
>and
>
>BMX Next Blitz 20"
>http://tinyurl.com/oyfgv
>
>Both are the same price. Has anyone ever ridden either and if so, what
>is your opinion on it.
>
>What is the difference really between a BMX and a mountain bike?
At least three things.
Size; most BMX bikes use 20" wheels, while 26" is the more common size
for the mtb range. Mountain bikes use larger frames as well.
Equipment; most BMX bikes are single-speed, most mountain bikes have
multiple gears. All BMX bikes of my experience use the older
Ashtabula-style cranks, while any decent mountain bike uses a modern
three-piece crank assembly. BMX bikes use handlebars with a lot of
rise; mountain bikes use bars that are nearly or completely flat.
Racing versions may not even have a functional seat, since it is
assumed that the rider will pedal while standing at all times.
Rider capacity; Virtually no BMX bike is an acceptable fit for
someone over 160cm tall for anything but very short rides.
>When
>I was young, I never heard of mountain bikes and they seem to have come
>out of nowhere. To me they are just bmx bikes in a different form.
Not really. Although the activity of adults riding a normal-sized
bike off-road on trails was popularized by the mountain bike's arrival
on the scene as a discrete product with a firm identity, people who
needed to use a bike for transportation have been riding on dirt paths
for as long as bikes have been around. The modern mtb is just a
better-adapted (usually) device than most of its predecessors. The
BMX bike, on the other hand, is a new variant that arose in the late
1960s as an outgrowth of the popularization of the chopper-styled
bikes of that era. Prior to then, a bike with 20" wheels was strictly
considered a child's unit, and was ridden seated on paved surfaces for
the most part. The arrival of the high riser bars with the
fashion-driven Stingray and similar bikes opened up the possibility of
older kids riding them, and given their low typical gearing, they were
immediately recognized as being better adapted to motocross-style dirt
tracks than the conventional bikes of the era. While the
Stingray-style seat is not as common anymore, I recall when these
sidewalk bikes started getting used more for dashing through
improvised obstacle courses in vacant lots than anything else.
>Also, how tall of a person is a 20" tire bicycle intended for?
Most are a poor fit for an adult or late teenager.
>Any
>other things I should know before buying the bike?
Probably lots, but without knowing what information you already
possess, it's hard to say where the rest of the major gaps lie.
--
Typoes are a feature, not a bug.
Some gardening required to reply via email.
Words processed in a facility that contains nuts.
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Date: 25 Sep 2006 09:09:20
From: marian.rosenberg@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
vorange wrote:
> Yes I checked both bikes out at Walt. 20 inch wheels are much
> smaller than I thought! I wanted a small compact bike but that was too
> small. Its for children.
>
> The next step up would appear to be 24" followed by 26" tires which I
> will check out tommorrow.
>
> I was floored by the prices of some of the bikes sold in stores other
> than Walt. Some go into the thousands. What possible space age
> technology could demand such a price? The bike would have to float on
> air for me if I had to pay that much!
There is a broad range of difference between a commuter bike and a race
bike, a trail bike and a full suspension bike.
If you ever get into racing you start thinking in terms of fraction of
a second gins between you and the next best competitor. When you
are riding the bike on nature trails and to lunch it really doesn't
matter so much so as long as the bike is comfortable, performs
adequately, and is reasonably geared (to save your knees) and
reasonably lightweight.
As soon as I get a job and a paycheck I'm getting the 20,000rmb Bianchi
I've been lusting after for months. But I sold my 3000rmb race bike
when I was in the US this summer and I'm currently a traitor to the
cause of weight weeniesm with my merely acceptable ~2000rmb school bike
with downtube shifters, a rack, and a leather Brooks saddle. It
doesn't even have clipless pedals. (It was, however, free.)
I've lost about 6 kph off of my fastest hour. But I didn't ride in
August, I didn't train in July, and the fastest hour came at the end of
a month of intense training. Without currently having a race bike to
compare it to I can't be sure how much difference it makes but in terms
of being able to wear flip flops or jeans or ride over a dirt road
without worrying about potholes I'll take this bike.
When I have the thousands I'll spend the thousands. When you get the
sudden urge to take a weekend ride to the nearest international border
or decide you just have to do that century in under 5 hours or are
concerned about the competition beating you by 0.03 seconds in your
last race it makes a very real difference.
> I'm looking to take my bike down to the nature trail which means going
> over rocks and dirt tracks..etc. I thought a BMX bike was for offroad
> but it seems through the years, mountain bikes might have taken over
> that role.
For what you are doing a $300-$500 bike shop bike should be a fine
choice. Besides which, if you get serious, the components can always
be upgraded or the bike can be downgraded to rainy day commuter.
-M
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 22:26:18
From: Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
vorange wrote:
> Yes I checked both bikes out at Walt. 20 inch wheels are much
> smaller than I thought! I wanted a small compact bike but that was too
> small. Its for children.
Here is a real adult ATB with 20-inch wheels:
<http://www.bikefriday.com/bikeMMI.cfm?PG=1&BF=4&CAT=3#StartPoint >. One
does pay a considerable premium for being able to put the bike in an
airline legal suitcase, however.
> The next step up would appear to be 24" followed by 26" tires which I
> will check out tommorrow.
The selection of ISO 507-mm (24" ATB) tires, rims and bikes is very
poor compared to those using the ISO 559-mm (26" ATB) size. Unless one
is too short of stature to ride a bike with the ISO 559-mm wheel size,
the ISO 507-mm wheel size is best avoided.
> I was floored by the prices of some of the bikes sold in stores other
> than Walt. Some go into the thousands. What possible space age
> technology could demand such a price? The bike would have to float on
> air for me if I had to pay that much!
>
> I'm looking to take my bike down to the nature trail which means going
> over rocks and dirt tracks..etc. I thought a BMX bike was for offroad
> but it seems through the years, mountain bikes might have taken over
> that role.
The bikes you will find at discount store may be similar in appearance
to those sold in bicycle shops, but they are not intended for serious
off road use. The cheap bicycles have suspension systems/components
that offer poor functionality and will not hold up under off road use.
The same can be said of many other components, especially brakes and
anything with bearings. In addition, the discount store bicycles often
come in "one size fits none properly".
You would be better off in the long run with an entry level hard-tail
or non-suspended (hard to find now) bike from a real bike store. Such
bikes can be found in the $400-600 dollars range. If that is too
expensive, real mountain bikes from the late 1980's to late 1990's are
plentiful on the used ket, and can often be found in decent
condition for less than $100.
--
Tom Sherman - Here, not there.
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 21:22:55
From: vorange
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
Yes I checked both bikes out at Walt. 20 inch wheels are much
smaller than I thought! I wanted a small compact bike but that was too
small. Its for children.
The next step up would appear to be 24" followed by 26" tires which I
will check out tommorrow.
I was floored by the prices of some of the bikes sold in stores other
than Walt. Some go into the thousands. What possible space age
technology could demand such a price? The bike would have to float on
air for me if I had to pay that much!
I'm looking to take my bike down to the nature trail which means going
over rocks and dirt tracks..etc. I thought a BMX bike was for offroad
but it seems through the years, mountain bikes might have taken over
that role.
Dennis P. Harris wrote:
> On 24 Sep 2006 01:28:34 -0700 in rec.bicycles.misc, "vorange"
> <orangepic@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > Also, how tall of a person is a 20" tire bicycle intended for? Any
> > other things I should know before buying the bike?
>
> these are children's bikes, intended for someone under 14. anyone
> over 5 ft. 4 in. should be riding a 26 inch tire mtn bike.
>
> bmx bikes, fyi, are designed for trick riding and jumps, which is
> why they have footpegs mounted on front & rear hubs.
>
> a walt bike of any kind is likely to be assembled by someone
> who doesn't have a clue about bike mechanics, who can sort of
> read a picture diagram and breathe at the same time. they are
> heavy, very poor quality, and won't last more than a couple of
> months of commuting. they are basically designed to be destroyed
> by kids.
>
> for commuting, look for a mountain bike in the $300 range, put
> inverse tread city tires or fat smooth tires on it, and add a
> rack and fenders.
>
> if you can't afford a new $300 bike look for a used one in the
> $100-$150 range, perhaps at garage sales.
>
> for a commuting bike that you can count on, you need a bike that
> your local bike shop is willing to service.
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Date: 26 Sep 2006 08:55:40
From: Jim Higson
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
vorange wrote:
> I was floored by the prices of some of the bikes sold in stores other
> than Walt. Some go into the thousands. What possible space age
> technology could demand such a price? The bike would have to float on
> air for me if I had to pay that much!
If the bike shop is too expensive, I would advise to find a good quality
mountain bike second hand.
I mostly ride on the roads, but I wanted something to do the odd track. I
recently got up a no-suspension mountain bike from a good make (DAWES),
originally bought around 1995. It is still a very nice bike to ride, and
could easily handle nature trails etc.
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 20:52:57
From: Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
Don Wiss wrote:
> "Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >Will wrote:
> >> The OP
> >> was asking about Walt BMX bikes. You show links to $2,000 and $3,000
> >> (or more!!!) bikes with 20 inch wheels.
> >
> >A new RANS Rocket [1] is under $1,200 USD MSRP, while the RANS Tailwind
> >[2] is less than $1,000 USD MSRP. (These bikes are bargains, since they
> >perform as well as significantly more expensive recumbent bicycles).
> >The Sunset Lowracer and Dragonflyer trike are no longer in production
> >(as Earth Cycles is defunct), but the Sunset would be expected to sell
> >in the price range mentioned, and the Dragonflyer above that.
>
> Ah, just as I expected. You have an agenda. You took this as an opportunity
> to push your recumbents. The regulars here are well aware of their
> existence. But they are totally inappropriate for the OP.
However, my point remains. I am in the normal height range for an adult
male (~1.82-m), and I ride bicycles with 20-inch (decimal size) wheels
that DO NOT have long seat posts.
--
Tom Sherman - Here, not there.
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 20:22:12
From: Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
Will wrote:
> Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman wrote:
>
> > I was referring to a bike that looks very much like this one: <
>
> <shows pictures of expensive recumbents that will never be sold at
> Wal-t in a million years>
Wal-t is where you go when you wish to purchase a COMMODITY at the
lowest retail price. Proper bicycles are not commodities.
> Johnny,
>
> It's clear that your no-helmet position has it's ramifications. The OP
> was asking about Walt BMX bikes. You show links to $2,000 and $3,000
> (or more!!!) bikes with 20 inch wheels.
A new RANS Rocket [1] is under $1,200 USD MSRP, while the RANS Tailwind
[2] is less than $1,000 USD MSRP. (These bikes are bargains, since they
perform as well as significantly more expensive recumbent bicycles).
The Sunset Lowracer and Dragonflyer trike are no longer in production
(as Earth Cycles is defunct), but the Sunset would be expected to sell
in the price range mentioned, and the Dragonflyer above that.
> If I was Ed Dolan I would simply call you a brain damaged idiot. Since I am not Ed
> Dolan I *assume extreme stupidity.
I have been called much worse by Ed Dolan. ;)
> Maybe you should start:
>
> 1) wearing a helmet (so we know you have intelligent capacity)
Actually, since the mid 1980's, I have worn a Magic Foam Hat more than
99% (time and mileage) when riding a bicycle. However, I do not expect
much out of it beyond scrape and bump protection in minor crashed (or
head to station wagon hatch contact).
> 2) reading the thread.
Familiarize yourself with the concept of "thread drift". I do not
always restrain my comments to exactly the subject of the original
post, since Usenet is not a forum with strict debating rules.
[1] <http://www.ransbikes.com/Rocket.htm# >.
[2] <http://www.ransbikes.com/tailwind.htm# >.
--
Tom Sherman - Here, not there.
|
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 23:37:46
From: Don Wiss
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
"Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com > wrote:
>Will wrote:
>> The OP
>> was asking about Walt BMX bikes. You show links to $2,000 and $3,000
>> (or more!!!) bikes with 20 inch wheels.
>
>A new RANS Rocket [1] is under $1,200 USD MSRP, while the RANS Tailwind
>[2] is less than $1,000 USD MSRP. (These bikes are bargains, since they
>perform as well as significantly more expensive recumbent bicycles).
>The Sunset Lowracer and Dragonflyer trike are no longer in production
>(as Earth Cycles is defunct), but the Sunset would be expected to sell
>in the price range mentioned, and the Dragonflyer above that.
Ah, just as I expected. You have an agenda. You took this as an opportunity
to push your recumbents. The regulars here are well aware of their
existence. But they are totally inappropriate for the OP.
Don <www.donwiss.com > (e-mail link at home page bottom).
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 20:01:39
From: Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
Don Wiss wrote:
> Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >Don Wiss wrote:
> >> "Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> >Don Wiss wrote:
> >> >> On 24 Sep 2006 01:28:34 -0700, vorange <orangepic@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> >Also, how tall of a person is a 20" tire bicycle intended for? Any
> >> >> >other things I should know before buying the bike?
> >> >>
> >> >> To not damage your knees your leg should be almost straight on the down
> >> >> pedal. So for a normal adult male you'd need a pretty long seat post on a
> >> >> 20" bike.
> >> >
> >> >My "20-inch" bike lacks a seat post and my leg is almost straight out
> >> >at the "3 o'clock" position.
> >>
> >> But he is asking about a 20" tire bicycle. To which I am responding.
> >
> >I was referring to a bike that looks very much like this one: <
> >http://www.pedalkraft.de/_borders/Rocket_HR300.jpg>. Note the ISO
> >406-mm (20-inch decimal) size wheels.
>
> But the thread is about BMX bikes!
I am countering an ingrained prejudice that bikes with small diameter
wheels are not to be taken seriously.
--
Tom Sherman - Here, not there.
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Date: 25 Sep 2006 08:12:24
From: Frank Drackman
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
"Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:1159153299.011711.262790@m7g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
>
> Don Wiss wrote:
>> Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> >Don Wiss wrote:
>> >> "Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >Don Wiss wrote:
>> >> >> On 24 Sep 2006 01:28:34 -0700, vorange <orangepic@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >Also, how tall of a person is a 20" tire bicycle intended for?
>> >> >> >Any
>> >> >> >other things I should know before buying the bike?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> To not damage your knees your leg should be almost straight on the
>> >> >> down
>> >> >> pedal. So for a normal adult male you'd need a pretty long seat
>> >> >> post on a
>> >> >> 20" bike.
>> >> >
>> >> >My "20-inch" bike lacks a seat post and my leg is almost straight out
>> >> >at the "3 o'clock" position.
>> >>
>> >> But he is asking about a 20" tire bicycle. To which I am responding.
>> >
>> >I was referring to a bike that looks very much like this one: <
>> >http://www.pedalkraft.de/_borders/Rocket_HR300.jpg>. Note the ISO
>> >406-mm (20-inch decimal) size wheels.
>>
>> But the thread is about BMX bikes!
>
> I am countering an ingrained prejudice that bikes with small diameter
> wheels are not to be taken seriously.
>
> --
Nope, you are following your typical behavior. Trying to hijack a thread to
make it all about you.
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 19:25:26
From: Will
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman wrote:
> I was referring to a bike that looks very much like this one: <
<shows pictures of expensive recumbents that will never be sold at
Wal-t in a million years >
Johnny,
It's clear that your no-helmet position has it's ramifications. The OP
was asking about Walt BMX bikes. You show links to $2,000 and $3,000
(or more!!!) bikes with 20 inch wheels. If I was Ed Dolan I would
simply call you a brain damaged idiot. Since I am not Ed Dolan I
*assume extreme stupidity.
Maybe you should start:
1) wearing a helmet (so we know you have intelligent capacity)
2) reading the thread.
xxxooo
Will
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 18:45:24
From: Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
Don Wiss wrote:
> "Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >Don Wiss wrote:
> >> On 24 Sep 2006 01:28:34 -0700, vorange <orangepic@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> >Also, how tall of a person is a 20" tire bicycle intended for? Any
> >> >other things I should know before buying the bike?
> >>
> >> To not damage your knees your leg should be almost straight on the down
> >> pedal. So for a normal adult male you'd need a pretty long seat post on a
> >> 20" bike.
> >
> >My "20-inch" bike lacks a seat post and my leg is almost straight out
> >at the "3 o'clock" position.
>
> But he is asking about a 20" tire bicycle. To which I am responding.
I was referring to a bike that looks very much like this one: <
http://www.pedalkraft.de/_borders/Rocket_HR300.jpg >. Note the ISO
406-mm (20-inch decimal) size wheels.
Here is another of my bicycles with 20-inch wheels:
<http://www.ransbikes.com/Gallery/Archive/images/Sherman1.jpg >.
The bike I ride the most has a 20-inch drive wheel, but a 16-inch (ISO
305-mm) front wheel"
<http://www.ihpva.org/incoming/2002/sunset/Sunset001.jpg >.
My trike also has 20-inch wheels:
<http://www.ihpva.org/incoming/2002/Dragonflyer/df1a.jpg >.
--
Tom Sherman - Here, not there.
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 21:57:32
From: Don Wiss
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com > wrote:
>Don Wiss wrote:
>> "Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> >Don Wiss wrote:
>> >> On 24 Sep 2006 01:28:34 -0700, vorange <orangepic@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >Also, how tall of a person is a 20" tire bicycle intended for? Any
>> >> >other things I should know before buying the bike?
>> >>
>> >> To not damage your knees your leg should be almost straight on the down
>> >> pedal. So for a normal adult male you'd need a pretty long seat post on a
>> >> 20" bike.
>> >
>> >My "20-inch" bike lacks a seat post and my leg is almost straight out
>> >at the "3 o'clock" position.
>>
>> But he is asking about a 20" tire bicycle. To which I am responding.
>
>I was referring to a bike that looks very much like this one: <
>http://www.pedalkraft.de/_borders/Rocket_HR300.jpg>. Note the ISO
>406-mm (20-inch decimal) size wheels.
But the thread is about BMX bikes!
Don <www.donwiss.com > (e-mail link at home page bottom).
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 15:43:36
From: Dennis P. Harris
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
On 24 Sep 2006 01:28:34 -0700 in rec.bicycles.misc, "vorange"
<orangepic@yahoo.com > wrote:
> Also, how tall of a person is a 20" tire bicycle intended for? Any
> other things I should know before buying the bike?
these are children's bikes, intended for someone under 14. anyone
over 5 ft. 4 in. should be riding a 26 inch tire mtn bike.
bmx bikes, fyi, are designed for trick riding and jumps, which is
why they have footpegs mounted on front & rear hubs.
a walt bike of any kind is likely to be assembled by someone
who doesn't have a clue about bike mechanics, who can sort of
read a picture diagram and breathe at the same time. they are
heavy, very poor quality, and won't last more than a couple of
months of commuting. they are basically designed to be destroyed
by kids.
for commuting, look for a mountain bike in the $300 range, put
inverse tread city tires or fat smooth tires on it, and add a
rack and fenders.
if you can't afford a new $300 bike look for a used one in the
$100-$150 range, perhaps at garage sales.
for a commuting bike that you can count on, you need a bike that
your local bike shop is willing to service.
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 13:45:56
From: Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
Don Wiss wrote:
> On 24 Sep 2006 01:28:34 -0700, vorange <orangepic@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >Also, how tall of a person is a 20" tire bicycle intended for? Any
> >other things I should know before buying the bike?
>
> To not damage your knees your leg should be almost straight on the down
> pedal. So for a normal adult male you'd need a pretty long seat post on a
> 20" bike.
My "20-inch" bike lacks a seat post and my leg is almost straight out
at the "3 o'clock" position.
--
Tom Sherman - Here, not there.
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 17:44:39
From: Don Wiss
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
"Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com > wrote:
>Don Wiss wrote:
>> On 24 Sep 2006 01:28:34 -0700, vorange <orangepic@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> >Also, how tall of a person is a 20" tire bicycle intended for? Any
>> >other things I should know before buying the bike?
>>
>> To not damage your knees your leg should be almost straight on the down
>> pedal. So for a normal adult male you'd need a pretty long seat post on a
>> 20" bike.
>
>My "20-inch" bike lacks a seat post and my leg is almost straight out
>at the "3 o'clock" position.
But he is asking about a 20" tire bicycle. To which I am responding.
Don <www.donwiss.com > (e-mail link at home page bottom).
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Date: 25 Sep 2006 01:34:50
From: Mike Causer
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
On Sun, 24 Sep 2006 17:44:39 -0400, Don Wiss wrote:
> "Johnny Sunset aka Tom Sherman" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>Don Wiss wrote:
>>> On 24 Sep 2006 01:28:34 -0700, vorange <orangepic@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> >Also, how tall of a person is a 20" tire bicycle intended for? Any
>>> >other things I should know before buying the bike?
>>>
>>> To not damage your knees your leg should be almost straight on the down
>>> pedal. So for a normal adult male you'd need a pretty long seat post on
>>> a 20" bike.
>>
>>My "20-inch" bike lacks a seat post and my leg is almost straight out at
>>the "3 o'clock" position.
>
> But he is asking about a 20" tire bicycle. To which I am responding.
And Tom is talking about a 20" wheeled bike too. My various 16", 17" and
20" (at one end) tired (!) bikes allow me at 172cm height to stretch out
fully.
While I'm here -- if you plan to ride the bike don't buy from Wal-t, or
any large chain (however I believe that the French Decathlon chain are an
exception).
Mike
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 16:33:39
From: Don Wiss
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
On 24 Sep 2006 01:28:34 -0700, vorange <orangepic@yahoo.com > wrote:
>Also, how tall of a person is a 20" tire bicycle intended for? Any
>other things I should know before buying the bike?
To not damage your knees your leg should be almost straight on the down
pedal. So for a normal adult male you'd need a pretty long seat post on a
20" bike.
Don <www.donwiss.com > (e-mail link at home page bottom).
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 16:01:31
From:
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
vorange <orangepic@yahoo.com > wrote:
> I want to buy a bmx type of bike from walt.
My best advice: don't by ANYTHING from Wal-t.
Bill
__o
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 15:51:27
From: Chris Y.F.N.W.
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
A Jinxian swampdweller wrote:
>My best advice: don't by ANYTHING
>from Wal-t.
>Bill
To which I heartilly agree. Wally World knows little about bikes, so it
will probably be assembled wrong, and some bike shops won't even touch
the things.
- -
Comments and opinions compliments of,
"Your Friendly Neighborhood Wheelman"
My web Site:
http://geocities.com/czcorner
Messages sent to the above "E" addy will be lost forever
to E-mail me:
ChrisZCorner "at" webtv "dot" net
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 19:49:30
From: chuck
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
On 2006-09-24, D_Frumious_B@ndersnat.ch <D_Frumious_B@ndersnat.ch > wrote:
> vorange <orangepic@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> I want to buy a bmx type of bike from walt.
>
> My best advice: don't by ANYTHING from Wal-t.
>
>
> Bill
>
>
What are you trying to do with an attitude like that? But Chinamen out
of work? Shame on you, not supporting the PRC. ;)
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 04:50:27
From: sandro
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
vorange wrote:
> I want to buy a bmx type of bike from walt. Visited walt to take
> a look at what they have.
>
> What is the difference really between a BMX and a mountain bike? When
> I was young, I never heard of mountain bikes and they seem to have come
> out of nowhere. To me they are just bmx bikes in a different form.
If I remember my 80's lore correctly, BMX bikes were designed for
tracks of a similar vein to motocross tracks, mountain bikes were
designed for more general purpose off-road bicycling. In general, I'd
say that BMX bikes are much more compact and not really designed for
any form of distance riding by an adult (where as they might suffice
for children < 12).
> Any
> other things I should know before buying the bike?
Well, what do you want to do with the bike? If it's a first bike for a
child, then the Wal-t bikes are probably OK (not great, but they'll
grow out of them quick anyway). If you want to commute on it daily,
I'd say you need to invest in a more reliable ride than is available at
the local mega-t. I haven't ridden a department store bike in
almost 30 years, but from what I've seen the parts are usually pretty
hard to adjust, there are questionable brakes on some, and they are
*heavy*. A good used bike is usually no more expensive and will
deliver many years of more satisfactory riding.
-Sandro
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Date: 24 Sep 2006 16:27:21
From: Don Wiss
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
On 24 Sep 2006 04:50:27 -0700, "sandro" <sandro.fouche@gmail.com > wrote:
>the local mega-t. I haven't ridden a department store bike in
>almost 30 years, but from what I've seen the parts are usually pretty
>hard to adjust, there are questionable brakes on some, and they are
>*heavy*.
One reason they are heavy is they have steel wheels. Steel wheels are
useless for braking in the rain.
Don <www.donwiss.com > (e-mail link at home page bottom).
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Date: 26 Sep 2006 10:42:56
From: SMS
Subject: Re: Buying a bike
|
Don Wiss wrote:
> On 24 Sep 2006 04:50:27 -0700, "sandro" <sandro.fouche@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> the local mega-t. I haven't ridden a department store bike in
>> almost 30 years, but from what I've seen the parts are usually pretty
>> hard to adjust, there are questionable brakes on some, and they are
>> *heavy*.
>
> One reason they are heavy is they have steel wheels. Steel wheels are
> useless for braking in the rain.
Some guy stopped by my garage sale last Saturday on a Wal-t road
bike, the GMC Denali model made by Kent and sold for $150.
"http://www.kentbicycles.com/bikes_gmc.html"
It wasn't as horrible as you might think. The frame was welded aluminum,
with ugly welds, but no worse than the low-end road bikes from a bike
shop (as Sheldon stated, aluminum frames cost the bicycle manufacturer
about $8). The wheels were alloy wheels. He had already replaced the
bottom bracket with a sealed unit after the original bottom bracket
failed. The shifters were in a very strange place, twist shifters in the
location where "safety brake" handles used to go.
Personally, I'd buy a used chromolly steel road bike for $150 rather
than a Wal-t bike.
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