Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

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Date: 23 Apr 2007 21:42:55
From: oilfreeandhappy
Subject: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
their back, bag or seat. It seems to me, that this is one of the best
ways to encourage cycling. I look at it this way. I have to read some
very stupid bumper stickers, so why not display my own message. Plus,
my message is more readable than a bumper sticker, since I have a
larger surface area.
----
Jim Gagnepain
http://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

Date: 05 May 2007 11:16:52
From: runcyclexcski@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

i forgot the main part - if those changes are made, I will order 2 T-
shirts from www.oilfreeandhappy.org, for the suggested donation
amount, even though I don't like the design.

Date: 05 May 2007 11:02:05
From: runcyclexcski@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

Here are three changes to make to convince me that it's not about the
money:

1. www.oilfreeandhappy.com becomes www.oilfreeandhappy.org

2. T shirts become free.

3. "Add to cart" button becomes "Make a donation" button. Suggested
donation amount :$5. I remember ordering 100 Tshirts with my own
design (cheesy) for a local high school team, 3 colors, $4 a piece.

Can you take the challenge?

BTW, I don't like your T-shirt design. Too much stuff, and the
messages are too hard to read. Especially when the cyclist is passed
by the intendend audience traveling at 50 mph.

Date: 02 May 2007 09:55:24
From: Bill H.
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 24, 5:34 pm, Michael Warner <s...@homepage.com > wrote:
> On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 21:44:35 +0000 (UTC), Alex Colvin wrote:
> > I'm trying to think of anything that I did because of a bumper sticker.
>
> Honk? Flash your tits? Give up everything you own and preach in the desert?
>
> --
> Home page:http://members.westnet.com.au/mvw

That's nothing. I freed Tibet.

Date: 02 May 2007 17:25:53
From: Ryan Cousineau
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

In article <1178124924.210606.61620@c35g2000hsg.googlegroups.com >,
"Bill H." <billhen@gmail.com > wrote:

> On Apr 24, 5:34 pm, Michael Warner <s...@homepage.com> wrote:
> > On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 21:44:35 +0000 (UTC), Alex Colvin wrote:
> > > I'm trying to think of anything that I did because of a bumper sticker.
> >
> > Honk? Flash your tits? Give up everything you own and preach in the desert?
> >
> > --
> > Home page:http://members.westnet.com.au/mvw
>
> That's nothing. I freed Tibet.

I didn't follow him (he was lost too).

--
Ryan Cousineau rcousine@sfu.ca http://www.wiredcola.com/
"I don't want kids who are thinking about going into mathematics
to think that they have to take drugs to succeed." -Paul Erdos

Date: 30 Apr 2007 02:10:49
From: Tom Keats
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

In article <eN5Yh.132388$aG1.53428@pd7urf3no >,
"nash" <zwepytzkehillc9@jetable.net > writes:
> If someone expresses an interest, I'll gladly do what I can to
> hold the door open for them. But I won't push them through.
> <<<<<<<<<<<<
>
> How is wearing a t-shirt pushing them through.

Well, actually I was responding to Jim's point about
"debates, logical arguments and even advertising."
I took that as cycling advocacy in a sense broader
than merely wearing stuff with cute captions printed
on it, and a certain type of advocacy that's not so
much pro-cycling, but anti-car driving. Okay, I don't
like excessive car driving, myself. But you can't get
people on your side by /accusing/ them. Even if you're
not really accusing them of anything, but they think
you are.

> Are you afraid to just
> agree?

I guess I /am/ too leery of unintended consequences
to just agree. From what I've seen in crossposts
to this newsgroup, some drivers take the mere act
of somebody riding a bike as a personal criticism
against them. It seems to me we're sometimes perceived
as shoving our "Green agendae" down their throats.

But if they're feeling guilt pangs about their ecological/
social auto-largesse, I guess that's a step in the right
direction.

Anyways, the medium is the message. And just riding a
bike seems to be a fairly potent medium in its own right,
without the need for message-ridden swag.

[brevity snip]

> Heck I would wear a "Don't Smoke" T-shirt if I thought it would help but I
> don't feel guilty if it turns some into smokers because they are spiteful.
> Just planting the seed so to speak.

I wouldn't mind wearing a T-shirt that just has "Wheee!"
printed on the back, in big, block letters.

...

> What bugs me more than drivers though is the crap on the road, like
> potholes, gravel, dirt, nails, glass, wet leaves, rocks, etc., even more
> than words.

And people in cars who flick cigarette butts out their windows.

cheers,
Tom

--
Nothing is safe from me.
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats curlicue vcn dot bc dot ca

Date: 28 Apr 2007 06:52:30
From: oilfreeandhappy
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 27, 1:27 am, "Bill Sornson" <a...@ask.me > wrote:
>
> But it's an insipid question that it /seems/ you come around and ask every
> 3-4 months.
>
> Whatever.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

1. I've never asked this question in rec.bicycle.misc. I challenge
you to show me that I'm wrong.
2. Are you the self-appointed moderator of this group? I would be
willing to bet that any reasonable moderator would have no problem
with this post. Perhaps you could start your own group, and moderate
the heck out of it. Let's see how many stay around.
3. I've seen a number of your posts, and you (and some of the others
in the Bicycle groups on Google) do nothing but attack others.
----
Jim Gagnepain
http://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

Date: 28 Apr 2007 08:12:44
From: Bill Sornson
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

oilfreeandhappy wrote:
> On Apr 27, 1:27 am, "Bill Sornson" <a...@ask.me> wrote:
>>
>> But it's an insipid question that it /seems/ you come around and ask
>> every 3-4 months.
>>
>> Whatever.- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> 1. I've never asked this question in rec.bicycle.misc. I challenge
> you to show me that I'm wrong.

As I wrote, it /seems/ like you pop in this or other newsgroups every few
months and "innocently ask" if people "make a statement" while they ride.

Then, whaddya know -- you just happen to SELL PRODUCTS designed to "make a
statement" while one rides.

If you were a regular contributor to varying threads, then just having your
sig file would be one thing. But even then, if you posted your silly "do
you make a statement" thing every few months, it would obviously be
self-serving (AKA "SPAM"). Most people don't care for SPAM.

HTH (but doubt it)

Date: 26 Apr 2007 23:38:55
From: oilfreeandhappy
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 27, 12:18 am, "Bill Sornson" <a...@ask.me > wrote:
> oilfreeandhappy wrote:
> > On Apr 25, 11:34 pm, "Bill Sornson" <a...@ask.me> wrote:
> >> With a handy little link to your site that just /happens/ to feature
> >> items for sale that "Make a Statement".
>
> >> It's about as transparent as it gets, greasy.
>
> >> BS (really)
>
> > Part of the signature, clearly separated from the message. Many
> > people do this.
>
> But they don't "introduce threads" about what they sell and act like it's
> just a coincidence.

You're right. It certainly wasn't a coincidence. I don't see
anything wrong in being passionate about advocating conservation. Is
it a problem If someone chooses to visit my website off my signature?
Is there harm in this? It's not a blatant Advert. It's simply an
option, if someone chooses to pursue the relevance to the thread. I
also mentioned One Less Car. They have a website. I mentioned Share
the Road. They have a website. The main focus is on the concept of
Make-a-Statement.
----
Jim Gagnepain
http://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

Date: 27 Apr 2007 00:27:05
From: Bill Sornson
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

oilfreeandhappy wrote:
> On Apr 27, 12:18 am, "Bill Sornson" <a...@ask.me> wrote:
>> oilfreeandhappy wrote:
>>> On Apr 25, 11:34 pm, "Bill Sornson" <a...@ask.me> wrote:
>>>> With a handy little link to your site that just /happens/ to
>>>> feature items for sale that "Make a Statement".
>>
>>>> It's about as transparent as it gets, greasy.
>>
>>>> BS (really)
>>
>>> Part of the signature, clearly separated from the message. Many
>>> people do this.
>>
>> But they don't "introduce threads" about what they sell and act like
>> it's just a coincidence.
>
> You're right. It certainly wasn't a coincidence. I don't see
> anything wrong in being passionate about advocating conservation. Is
> it a problem If someone chooses to visit my website off my signature?
> Is there harm in this? It's not a blatant Advert. It's simply an
> option, if someone chooses to pursue the relevance to the thread. I
> also mentioned One Less Car. They have a website. I mentioned Share
> the Road. They have a website. The main focus is on the concept of
> Make-a-Statement.

But it's an insipid question that it /seems/ you come around and ask every
3-4 months.

Whatever.

Date: 26 Apr 2007 23:25:23
From: oilfreeandhappy
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 25, 11:19 am, "DI" <di9...@cox.net > wrote:
> "Dane Buson" <d...@unseen.edu> wrote in message
> I hope he doesn't ride on asphalt paved roads.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Did I build the road? Maybe my tax dollars did. Even so, I'm
certainly not building the road as I'm riding my bike. As I
mentioned, I don't claim an Oil-Free life.

I have nothing against OIL. As a matter of fact, I think it's one of
the most important resources on the planets. Tiny intricate plastic
devices that can ONLY be derived from oil are used in complex
surgeries. As such, I would like to see our oil conserved for many,
many generations to come. Instead, we seem to burn it up, like there
is NO TOMORROW.
----
Jim Gagnepain
http://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

Date: 26 Apr 2007 23:18:56
From: oilfreeandhappy
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 26, 3:01 pm, "Bill H." <bill...@gmail.com > wrote:
> On Apr 24, 3:55 pm, oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_ha...@comcast.net>
> wrote:
>
> Two points:
>
> 1) I think it's more than a little self-righteous to wear flags,
> stickers, and whatnot that say "One Less Car." or some similar "I'm-
> better-because-I-bike" message. Express yourself if you want, but
> what you're really doing is claiming some superiority over someone who
> can't, or chooses not to ride a bike.

I don't believe that my messages claim a "better than thou" attitude.
They're merely saying that "Not everyone needs to burn gasoline to get
from A to B, and the alternative can be FUN". Another person
interpreted my message as "Oil-Free and Loving It", and that's the way
I think of it. Again it's all about encouraging alternatives.

>
> 2) Secondly, do you honestly care about what some stranger thinks of
> how much money you have? I don't. When I get on my bike, I'm riding
> for me because I enjoy it, and it's great exercise. Someone thinks
> I'm poor...I truly couldn't care less.

Agreed. I'm not sure what this is in reference to...

>
> > Jim Gagnepainhttp://www.OilFreeandHappy.com
>
> You're not oil free. Not even close to being oil-free. If you've
> purchased anything in your life, you've supported the oil companies.
> I don't care if you've never purchased gasoline in your life. The
> food you eat, the clothes you wear, the computer you're using...all
> this was brought to you by oil-powered vehicles.

Read response above.

Date: 26 Apr 2007 23:08:43
From: oilfreeandhappy
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 26, 12:15 am, "joseph.santanie...@gmail.com"
<joseph.santanie...@gmail.com > wrote:
>
> I don't think there is any reason on a personal level to worry about
> what others think of you, but in order to have the biggest impression
> in order to effect change with a message, you need to appear "normal"
> otherwise you are dismissed as lunatic fringe. Most of the people who
> respond positively to your message are already on board at least in
> thought. It's preaching to the choir in a way. Most people don't want
> to be part of or associated with a lunatic fringe, so I think the best
> way to get normal people to ride bikes is to show them more normal
> people riding bikes. Otherwise they think cycling in only for what
> they perceived of as freaks. This goes for any protest type activity
> as well. Which would get more milage with "the masses" at home: a news
> clip of 100 grungy kids whining about something, or 100 soccer moms
> holding a petition?
>
> Joseph- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

So please define "normal". Is it wearing a colorful bicycling jersey
that nobody else on the planet wears? I have nothing against bicycle
jerseys. I own a few myself. Is any bumper sticker "normal". Is a
large jacket with "Cannondale" imprinted across the front "normal"?
Or is "normal" just what Joseph thinks is normal.

A lot of white supremacists didn't think Martin Luther King, Jr. was
normal, and one even shot him to death. You seem to want "Middle of
the Road", which has accomplished nothing in our AutoCentric country
for the last 70 years. I claim that the "Middle Ground" is
devastating our country and our world. 25-40% of the US Trade Deficit
is from imported oil. Global warming? Are all these scientists
wrong? And every day, life goes on, and the "Middle Ground"
accomplishes nothing. My stance is one of action, not only bicycling,
but in expressing a challenge.
----
Jim Gagnepain
http://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

Date: 26 Apr 2007 22:56:51
From: oilfreeandhappy
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 25, 11:34 pm, "Bill Sornson" <a...@ask.me > wrote:
> With a handy little link to your site that just /happens/ to feature items
> for sale that "Make a Statement".
>
> It's about as transparent as it gets, greasy.
>
> BS (really)

Part of the signature, clearly separated from the message. Many
people do this.
----
Jim Gagnepain
http://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

Date: 26 Apr 2007 23:18:27
From: Bill Sornson
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

oilfreeandhappy wrote:
> On Apr 25, 11:34 pm, "Bill Sornson" <a...@ask.me> wrote:
>> With a handy little link to your site that just /happens/ to feature
>> items for sale that "Make a Statement".
>>
>> It's about as transparent as it gets, greasy.
>>
>> BS (really)
>
> Part of the signature, clearly separated from the message. Many
> people do this.

But they don't "introduce threads" about what they sell and act like it's
just a coincidence.

Date: 26 Apr 2007 14:01:54
From: Bill H.
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 24, 3:55 pm, oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_ha...@comcast.net >
wrote:

> A "cycling advocacy" message simply takes it a step further. It makes
> it very clear to passers-by, that you are riding for a reason.
> Without it, there are those who may think, "That poor fellow, he can't
> afford a car" or "Poor guy must have gotten his driver's license
> suspended". A message, such as "One Less Car" or other, lays those
> notions to rest.

Two points:

1) I think it's more than a little self-righteous to wear flags,
stickers, and whatnot that say "One Less Car." or some similar "I'm-
better-because-I-bike" message. Express yourself if you want, but
what you're really doing is claiming some superiority over someone who
can't, or chooses not to ride a bike.

2) Secondly, do you honestly care about what some stranger thinks of
how much money you have? I don't. When I get on my bike, I'm riding
for me because I enjoy it, and it's great exercise. Someone thinks
I'm poor...I truly couldn't care less.

> Jim Gagnepainhttp://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

You're not oil free. Not even close to being oil-free. If you've
purchased anything in your life, you've supported the oil companies.
I don't care if you've never purchased gasoline in your life. The
food you eat, the clothes you wear, the computer you're using...all
this was brought to you by oil-powered vehicles.

Date: 26 Apr 2007 00:11:02
From: Tom Keats
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

In article <1177568104.091940.86690@r30g2000prh.googlegroups.com >,
"joseph.santaniello@gmail.com" <joseph.santaniello@gmail.com > writes:

> Which would get more milage with "the masses" at home: a news
> clip of 100 grungy kids whining about something, or 100 soccer moms
> holding a petition?

The Boston Pizza commercial with Louie the sasquatch pointing
and gutterally exclaiming: "Meaaat balll!"

cheers,
Tom

--
Nothing is safe from me.
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats curlicue vcn dot bc dot ca

Date: 26 Apr 2007 00:07:55
From: Tom Keats
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

In article <1177563357.690741.17020@c18g2000prb.googlegroups.com >,
oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_happy@comcast.net > writes:
> On Apr 24, 11:18 pm, tkeats2...@hotmail.com (Tom Keats) wrote:
>> In article <1177389775.292995.319...@s33g2000prh.googlegroups.com>,
>> oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_ha...@comcast.net> writes:
>>
>> > I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
>> > their back, bag or seat. It seems to me, that this is one of the best
>> > ways to encourage cycling.
>>
>> There's no such thing as encouraging cycling.
>> But there ~is~ /not discouraging/ it.
>>
>> It's kind of like gardening -- we can't force the
>> plants to grow and thrive, at least not beyond a
>> certain point. But we can avoid stepping on them.
>>
>> If someone wants to ride, they will. If they don't,
>> they won't.
>>
>> cheers,
>> Tom
>>
>> --
>> Nothing is safe from me.
>> Above address is just a spam midden.
>> I'm really at: tkeats curlicue vcn dot bc dot ca
>
> Interesting perspective. But doesn't this totally defeat any type of
> pursuasion - debates, logical arguments, even advertising?

Who wants to persuade/admonish/shame/nag or otherwise manipulate
half-hearted people to ride? If they decide they downright hate
it, the cycling cause might end up suffering more harm than good.

Besides it seems so banal to "market" the avocation of bicycling.
It's like those annoying people who keep saying: "Y'know what you
should do?"

If someone expresses an interest, I'll gladly do what I can to
hold the door open for them. But I won't push them through.

> I remember years ago, as a much younger man, I went to a convention in
> St. Louis. There was an older fellow there, with long grey hair, who
> had tree-trunks for legs, who had ridden a bicycle all the way from
> Minnesota. He was very vocal about cycling advocacy. I can tell you
> that he influenced at least one person. I've been riding ever since
> then.

I'm glad you stuck with riding. Not everybody would have.

cheers,
Tom

--
Nothing is safe from me.
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats curlicue vcn dot bc dot ca

Date: 26 Apr 2007 18:00:42
From: nash
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

If someone expresses an interest, I'll gladly do what I can to
hold the door open for them. But I won't push them through.
<<<<<<<<<<<<

How is wearing a t-shirt pushing them through. Are you afraid to just
agree?
It's not as if we can actually get hurt by words like you assume if some
would hate cycling even more.
The rest of the world doesnot think like that. They would just laugh.
It is called free speech. Tooting your own horn. Protecting your way of
life.
Heck I would wear a "Don't Smoke" T-shirt if I thought it would help but I
don't feel guilty if it turns some into smokers because they are spiteful.
Just planting the seed so to speak. Doing my part for the environment.
Assholes on the road just make me want to bike more and take more space.
Fighting fire with fire. Fortunately, I have not had to hit anyone's mirror
or bend their license in half for a couple years.
What bugs me more than drivers though is the crap on the road, like
potholes, gravel, dirt, nails, glass, wet leaves, rocks, etc., even more
than words.

Date: 25 Apr 2007 23:15:04
From: joseph.santaniello@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 24, 11:52 pm, oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_ha...@comcast.net >
wrote:
> > The problem with messages, is that the vast majority just ignore the
> > message by assuming the messenger is a wack-o.
>
> > Joseph
>
> Why do you say this? I've gotten complimented by a number of
> drivers. Also, I stopped worrying about what others think a long time
> ago. In terms of history, if certain individuals worried about being
> an outcast:
> 1. Women wouldn't be voting today.
> 2. Blacks wouldn't be playing baseball (or other sports).
> 3. We wouldn't have an ozone layer in our atmosphere.
> 4. There would still be a Berlin Wall.
> 5. Cars wouldn't have seat belts.
> 6. The AMA would still be practicing blood-letting.
> 7. Gas efficiency in cars would be worse than the Model T - Never mind
> this one, many cars get less MPG than the old Model T.
> etc, etc.

I don't think there is any reason on a personal level to worry about
what others think of you, but in order to have the biggest impression
in order to effect change with a message, you need to appear "normal"
otherwise you are dismissed as lunatic fringe. Most of the people who
respond positively to your message are already on board at least in
thought. It's preaching to the choir in a way. Most people don't want
to be part of or associated with a lunatic fringe, so I think the best
way to get normal people to ride bikes is to show them more normal
people riding bikes. Otherwise they think cycling in only for what
they perceived of as freaks. This goes for any protest type activity
as well. Which would get more milage with "the masses" at home: a news
clip of 100 grungy kids whining about something, or 100 soccer moms
holding a petition?

Joseph

Date: 26 Apr 2007 15:53:10
From: Mark Mitchell
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On 2007-04-26, joseph.santaniello@gmail.com <joseph.santaniello@gmail.com > wrote:
> On Apr 24, 11:52 pm, oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_ha...@comcast.net>
> wrote:
>> > The problem with messages, is that the vast majority just ignore the
>> > message by assuming the messenger is a wack-o.
>>
>> > Joseph
>>
>> Why do you say this? I've gotten complimented by a number of
>> drivers. Also, I stopped worrying about what others think a long time
>> ago. In terms of history, if certain individuals worried about being
>> an outcast:
>> 1. Women wouldn't be voting today.
>> 2. Blacks wouldn't be playing baseball (or other sports).
>> 3. We wouldn't have an ozone layer in our atmosphere.
>> 4. There would still be a Berlin Wall.
>> 5. Cars wouldn't have seat belts.
>> 6. The AMA would still be practicing blood-letting.
>> 7. Gas efficiency in cars would be worse than the Model T - Never mind
>> this one, many cars get less MPG than the old Model T.
>> etc, etc.
>
> I don't think there is any reason on a personal level to worry about
> what others think of you, but in order to have the biggest impression
> in order to effect change with a message, you need to appear "normal"
> otherwise you are dismissed as lunatic fringe. Most of the people who
> respond positively to your message are already on board at least in
> thought. It's preaching to the choir in a way. Most people don't want
> to be part of or associated with a lunatic fringe, so I think the best
> way to get normal people to ride bikes is to show them more normal
> people riding bikes. Otherwise they think cycling in only for what
> they perceived of as freaks. This goes for any protest type activity
> as well. Which would get more milage with "the masses" at home: a news
> clip of 100 grungy kids whining about something, or 100 soccer moms
> holding a petition?
>
> Joseph
>
Don't discount the value of a lunatic fringe. The sense of normality
is based on a comparison with the lunatic fringe. The further out it
is, the wider the 'normal' range.

Mark

Date: 26 Apr 2007 16:27:46
From: Dane Buson
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

Mark Mitchell <me@getbent.org > wrote:
>>
> Don't discount the value of a lunatic fringe. The sense of normality
> is based on a comparison with the lunatic fringe. The further out it
> is, the wider the 'normal' range.

Very true. Let me dig out the quote by Tooker Gomberg.

"We need radical activism so that the moderates
aren't ignored as a fringe element." - Tooker Gomberg

--
Dane Busoa- sigdane@unixbigots.org
"The key is to commit crimes so confusing that police feel too stupid to
even write a crime report about them."
-Aubrey, 'Something Positive'

Date: 25 Apr 2007 22:00:11
From: oilfreeandhappy
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 24, 5:25 pm, "Bill Sornson" <a...@ask.me > wrote:
>
> And you just happen to sell that crap. Keep it to .marketplace...- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Aren't we hostile. I said nothing about my Advocacy items in the
original post of this thread. I merely inquired about the concept of
Making a Statement while riding.

Date: 25 Apr 2007 22:34:56
From: Bill Sornson
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

oilfreeandhappy wrote:
> On Apr 24, 5:25 pm, "Bill Sornson" <a...@ask.me> wrote:
>>
>> And you just happen to sell that crap. Keep it to .marketplace...-
>> Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> Aren't we hostile. I said nothing about my Advocacy items in the
> original post of this thread. I merely inquired about the concept of
> Making a Statement while riding.

With a handy little link to your site that just /happens/ to feature items
for sale that "Make a Statement".

It's about as transparent as it gets, greasy.

BS (really)

Date: 25 Apr 2007 21:55:57
From: oilfreeandhappy
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 24, 11:18 pm, tkeats2...@hotmail.com (Tom Keats) wrote:
> In article <1177389775.292995.319...@s33g2000prh.googlegroups.com>,
> oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_ha...@comcast.net> writes:
>
> > I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
> > their back, bag or seat. It seems to me, that this is one of the best
> > ways to encourage cycling.
>
> There's no such thing as encouraging cycling.
> But there ~is~ /not discouraging/ it.
>
> It's kind of like gardening -- we can't force the
> plants to grow and thrive, at least not beyond a
> certain point. But we can avoid stepping on them.
>
> If someone wants to ride, they will. If they don't,
> they won't.
>
> cheers,
> Tom
>
> --
> Nothing is safe from me.
> Above address is just a spam midden.
> I'm really at: tkeats curlicue vcn dot bc dot ca

Interesting perspective. But doesn't this totally defeat any type of
pursuasion - debates, logical arguments, even advertising?

I remember years ago, as a much younger man, I went to a convention in
St. Louis. There was an older fellow there, with long grey hair, who
had tree-trunks for legs, who had ridden a bicycle all the way from
Minnesota. He was very vocal about cycling advocacy. I can tell you
that he influenced at least one person. I've been riding ever since
then.
----
Jim Gagnepain
http://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

Date: 25 Apr 2007 21:03:17
From: landotter
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 25, 12:18 am, tkeats2...@hotmail.com (Tom Keats) wrote:
> In article <1177389775.292995.319...@s33g2000prh.googlegroups.com>,
> oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_ha...@comcast.net> writes:
>
> > I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
> > their back, bag or seat. It seems to me, that this is one of the best
> > ways to encourage cycling.
>
> There's no such thing as encouraging cycling.

I don't know if I agree with that, but certainly the OP's concept of
empty mobile slogans are pointless.

> But there ~is~ /not discouraging/ it.
>
> It's kind of like gardening -- we can't force the
> plants to grow and thrive, at least not beyond a
> certain point. But we can avoid stepping on them.

Delightfully said. Bravo!

Just be a proper cyclist and those that are inclined to be influenced,
will be.

Date: 25 Apr 2007 18:26:45
From: victor.kan@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 24, 12:51 pm, catzz66 <catz...@threeletterservice.com > wrote:
> Nobody is oil free if they are consumers of any
> products at all, including bikes.

And despite what one of the shirts suggests, cyclists are not powered
by sweat, but by carbohydrates and lipids, producing C02, methane and
other "stuff" (albeit less than a single passenger car doing the same
distance).

Date: 25 Apr 2007 09:28:02
From: amakyonin
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

> The problem with messages, is that the vast majority just ignore the
> message by assuming the messenger is a wack-o. Perhaps the thing to do
> would be to cycle around in a Brooks Brothers suit.
>
> Joseph

I think a three piece Burberry riding suit with plusfours would be
more appealing.

Jim seems to be more interested in *environmentalist* advocacy that
*cycling* advocacy. There is nothing wrong with that in an appropriate
context but associating this message tightly with bicyclists just
strengthens the assertion that we're all nutters.

His assertion of being "oil free" is questionable since he is
obviously participating in our modern world and thereby making use of
a substantial amount of petroleum derived products like plastics (the
keyboard he types on) and essentially all manufactured products
indirectly. Even the Amish aren't oil free. I suggest that he drop out
of society and resort to backwoods survivalism if he really wants to
be oil free.

Date: 25 Apr 2007 10:48:48
From: Larry Farrell
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

amakyonin wrote:
[snip]
>
> His assertion of being "oil free" is questionable since he is
> obviously participating in our modern world and thereby making use of
> a substantial amount of petroleum derived products like plastics (the
> keyboard he types on) and essentially all manufactured products
> indirectly. Even the Amish aren't oil free. I suggest that he drop out
> of society and resort to backwoods survivalism if he really wants to
> be oil free.
>

How can even bicycling be "oil free?" After all, there are numerous
lubricants used to make the bicycle operate that are oil or oil-based.

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Date: 25 Apr 2007 14:14:20
From: catzz66
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

Larry Farrell wrote:
>
> How can even bicycling be "oil free?" After all, there are numerous
> lubricants used to make the bicycle operate that are oil or oil-based.
>

That's really my point. To say you are oil free sounds a little
sanctimonious since probably hardly anyone is completely oil free. If
you were to say you were "oil reduced and happy" would not sell quite as
many tshirts, but would probably be more truthful. If you lived in a
closed community in some remote part of the earth, only rode a camel or
a donkey for transportation and seldom if ever went to "town" and bought
something manufactured, you might come closer to being oil free than
anyone wearing an "I'm oil free" tshirt.

Date: 25 Apr 2007 19:31:01
From: nash
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

"catzz66" <catzz66@threeletterservice.com > wrote in message
news:599nkeF2jmsskU1@mid.individual.net...
> Larry Farrell wrote:
>>
>> How can even bicycling be "oil free?" After all, there are numerous
>> lubricants used to make the bicycle operate that are oil or oil-based.
>>
>
> That's really my point. To say you are oil free sounds a little
> sanctimonious since probably hardly anyone is completely oil free. If you
> were to say you were "oil reduced and happy" would not sell quite as many
> tshirts, but would probably be more truthful. If you lived in a closed
> community in some remote part of the earth, only rode a camel or a donkey
> for transportation and seldom if ever went to "town" and bought something
> manufactured, you might come closer to being oil free than anyone wearing
> an "I'm oil free" tshirt.

Well then think of it this way. How many times does a car need a quart of
oil. How many times does a bike need a quart of oil. Not even in my life
time folks.

Same for anyone thinking cars are as detrimental to the environment as bikes
because they both are made of natural resources. Get a grip on reality
hosers.
Yeah, you can say that if you buy the car and never never ever drive it.
Even though it still is not true but closer to the truth.

Date: 25 Apr 2007 19:36:23
From: nash
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

When going across Canada on our bikes we had "Pedalling Our Asses Across
Canada" t-shirts made.
They were white.
Ones I have now are bright yellow with "Allowed Use of Full Lane" in a
diamond shape sign with a bike.

Do not think they can be read that easy by speeding motorists but at least
it makes me more visible.

Date: 25 Apr 2007 10:01:51
From: Dane Buson
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

Larry Farrell <farrlarr@isu.edu > wrote:
> amakyonin wrote:
> [snip]
>>
>> His assertion of being "oil free" is questionable since he is
>> obviously participating in our modern world and thereby making use of
>> a substantial amount of petroleum derived products like plastics (the
>> keyboard he types on) and essentially all manufactured products
>> indirectly. Even the Amish aren't oil free. I suggest that he drop out
>> of society and resort to backwoods survivalism if he really wants to
>> be oil free.
>
> How can even bicycling be "oil free?" After all, there are numerous
> lubricants used to make the bicycle operate that are oil or oil-based.

Well, I suppose you could use some organic oil (soybean, olive,
soybean/beeswax, whatever) for your chain. I'm not quite sure what to
replace grease with. I have no desire to put goose grease (for
instance) into my headset.

--
Dane Buson - sigdane@unixbigots.org
"France is the only country where the money falls apart and you
can't tear the toilet paper." -Billy Wilder

Date: 25 Apr 2007 12:19:28
From: DI
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

"Dane Buson" <dane@unseen.edu > wrote in message
news:v4e4g4-p1i.ln1@curare.zuvembi.homelinux.org...
> Larry Farrell <farrlarr@isu.edu> wrote:
>> amakyonin wrote:
>> [snip]
>>>
>>> His assertion of being "oil free" is questionable since he is
>>> obviously participating in our modern world and thereby making use of
>>> a substantial amount of petroleum derived products like plastics (the
>>> keyboard he types on) and essentially all manufactured products
>>> indirectly. Even the Amish aren't oil free. I suggest that he drop out
>>> of society and resort to backwoods survivalism if he really wants to
>>> be oil free.
>>
>> How can even bicycling be "oil free?" After all, there are numerous
>> lubricants used to make the bicycle operate that are oil or oil-based.
>
> Well, I suppose you could use some organic oil (soybean, olive,
> soybean/beeswax, whatever) for your chain. I'm not quite sure what to
> replace grease with. I have no desire to put goose grease (for
> instance) into my headset.
>
> --
> Dane Buson - sigdane@unixbigots.org
> "France is the only country where the money falls apart and you
> can't tear the toilet paper." -Billy Wilder

I hope he doesn't ride on asphalt paved roads.

Date: 24 Apr 2007 22:18:32
From: Tom Keats
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

In article <1177389775.292995.319610@s33g2000prh.googlegroups.com >,
oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_happy@comcast.net > writes:
> I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
> their back, bag or seat. It seems to me, that this is one of the best
> ways to encourage cycling.

There's no such thing as encouraging cycling.
But there ~is~ /not discouraging/ it.

It's kind of like gardening -- we can't force the
plants to grow and thrive, at least not beyond a
certain point. But we can avoid stepping on them.

If someone wants to ride, they will. If they don't,
they won't.

cheers,
Tom

--
Nothing is safe from me.
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats curlicue vcn dot bc dot ca

Date: 25 Apr 2007 16:30:29
From: nash
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

"Tom Keats" <tkeats2005@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:8bom0f.o2g.ln@bud.garden.local...
> In article <1177389775.292995.319610@s33g2000prh.googlegroups.com>,
> oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_happy@comcast.net> writes:
>> I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
>> their back, bag or seat. It seems to me, that this is one of the best
>> ways to encourage cycling.
>
> There's no such thing as encouraging cycling.
> But there ~is~ /not discouraging/ it.
>
> It's kind of like gardening -- we can't force the
> plants to grow and thrive, at least not beyond a
> certain point. But we can avoid stepping on them.
>
> If someone wants to ride, they will. If they don't,
> they won't.
>
>
> cheers,
> Tom
>
> --
> Nothing is safe from me.
> Above address is just a spam midden.
> I'm really at: tkeats curlicue vcn dot bc dot ca

Yeah, but Tom if you do not plant a garden in the first place ie healthy
attitude to life, and cultivate, then the weeds will choke it out of
existence. Nurture nature.
Like Red Skeleton saying at the end of his show saying something like "If I
made just one person's day brighter I have done my job. Thank-you"

Date: 24 Apr 2007 17:35:55
From: jbollyn@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 23, 11:42 pm, oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_ha...@comcast.net >
wrote:
> I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
> their back, bag or seat. It seems to me, that this is one of the best
> ways to encourage cycling. I look at it this way. I have to read some
> very stupid bumper stickers, so why not display my own message. Plus,
> my message is more readable than a bumper sticker, since I have a
> larger surface area.
> ----
> Jim Gagnepainhttp://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

The only msg I want to convey to drivers approaching from behind, is
the unavoidable brightness of my presence. I am sure they initially
have no idea what that unusual bright flashing light is. I use it (on
city streets) always, regardless of time-of-day.

http://www.neiu.edu/~jbollyn/bike/dinotte-tail-light.jpg

Date: 24 Apr 2007 16:13:59
From: oilfreeandhappy
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 24, 6:05 am, "joseph.santanie...@gmail.com"
<joseph.santanie...@gmail.com > wrote:
>
> The problem with messages, is that the vast majority just ignore the
> message by assuming the messenger is a wack-o. Perhaps the thing to do
> would be to cycle around in a Brooks Brothers suit.
>
> Joseph

I stopped worrying about what others think of me a long time ago. Had
visionaries (and I'm not necessarily claiming to be one) been
concerned about conformity and appearances, the United States would
certainly be a different country:
1. Women would not have the right to vote.
2. Blacks would not be playing baseball.
3. We would have no ozone left in the atmosphere.
4. Cars would get gas mileage on par with Model T - never mind about
this one, many cars today, are less efficient than the Model T.
5. There would be no seat belts in cars.
----
Jim Gagnepain
http://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

Date: 24 Apr 2007 16:04:34
From: oilfreeandhappy
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

>
> And please buy my T-Shirts!

Yes, I do market Advocacy items. However, I can honestly say that I
am not in this for the money. I give items away to touring cyclists,
bicycle messengers, and other bicycle advocacy folks. Whenever I
replenish inventory, I return to the RED. I'm always willing to sell
items at cost, if people are interested.

My reason for getting into this is a form of Community Service. Our
country is addicted to oil, and I intend to do what I can to end that
addiction. If somebody reads one of my messages, and starts riding a
bicycle, I've succeeded. If they decide to purchase a more fuel-
efficient car, I've succeeded. If they start riding the light rail,
I've succeeded.
----
Jim Gagnepain
http://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

Date: 24 Apr 2007 15:56:43
From: oilfreeandhappy
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 24, 2:55 am, Sir Ridesalot <i_am_cycle_pat...@yahoo.ca > wrote:
> On Apr 24, 12:42 am, oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_ha...@comcast.net>
> wrote:
>
> > I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
> > their back, bag or seat. It seems to me, that this is one of the best
> > ways to encourage cycling. I look at it this way. I have to read some
> > very stupid bumper stickers, so why not display my own message. Plus,
> > my message is more readable than a bumper sticker, since I have a
> > larger surface area.
> > ----
> > Jim Gagnepainhttp://www.OilFreeandHappy.com
>
> Hi there.
>
> How about:
>
> This Vehicle Runs On Bananas And Water
>
> or
>
> This Vehicle Gets 50 Kms/Banana
>
> or
>
> Eating 2 Many Bananas = Jet Propulsion
>
> Cheers from Peter

Sounds good to me. Maybe you should have some T-Shirts made up!
----
Jim Gagnepain
http://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

Date: 24 Apr 2007 15:55:17
From: oilfreeandhappy
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 24, 12:03 am, "Bill Sornson" <a...@ask.me > wrote:
> oilfreeandhappy wrote:
> > I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
> > their back, bag or seat.
>
> Umm... I kinda think that RIDING MY BIKE is sorta pro-cycling.
>
> Bill "YMMV?" S.

I'm going to respond to each of the comments to this thread that I
started. I agree with you 100%. "Riding my bike" is first and
foremost, that's why I've been commuting to work for the last 20
years. And that's why I tour, shop and run errands by bicycle.

A "cycling advocacy" message simply takes it a step further. It makes
it very clear to passers-by, that you are riding for a reason.
Without it, there are those who may think, "That poor fellow, he can't
afford a car" or "Poor guy must have gotten his driver's license
suspended". A message, such as "One Less Car" or other, lays those
notions to rest.
----
Jim Gagnepain
http://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

Date: 24 Apr 2007 16:25:54
From: Bill Sornson
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

oilfreeandhappy wrote:
> On Apr 24, 12:03 am, "Bill Sornson" <a...@ask.me> wrote:
>> oilfreeandhappy wrote:
>>> I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message
>>> on their back, bag or seat.
>>
>> Umm... I kinda think that RIDING MY BIKE is sorta pro-cycling.
>>
>> Bill "YMMV?" S.
>
> I'm going to respond to each of the comments to this thread that I
> started. I agree with you 100%. "Riding my bike" is first and
> foremost, that's why I've been commuting to work for the last 20
> years. And that's why I tour, shop and run errands by bicycle.
>
> A "cycling advocacy" message simply takes it a step further. It makes
> it very clear to passers-by, that you are riding for a reason.

I ride my bike to ride my bike.

> Without it, there are those who may think, "That poor fellow, he can't
> afford a car" or "Poor guy must have gotten his driver's license
> suspended". A message, such as "One Less Car" or other, lays those
> notions to rest.

And you just happen to sell that crap. Keep it to .marketplace...

Date: 24 Apr 2007 14:52:01
From: oilfreeandhappy
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

>
> The problem with messages, is that the vast majority just ignore the
> message by assuming the messenger is a wack-o.
>
> Joseph

Why do you say this? I've gotten complimented by a number of
drivers. Also, I stopped worrying about what others think a long time
ago. In terms of history, if certain individuals worried about being
an outcast:
1. Women wouldn't be voting today.
2. Blacks wouldn't be playing baseball (or other sports).
3. We wouldn't have an ozone layer in our atmosphere.
4. There would still be a Berlin Wall.
5. Cars wouldn't have seat belts.
6. The AMA would still be practicing blood-letting.
7. Gas efficiency in cars would be worse than the Model T - Never mind
this one, many cars get less MPG than the old Model T.
etc, etc.
----
Jim Gagnepain
http://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

Date: 24 Apr 2007 21:44:35
From: Alex Colvin
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

>I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
>their back, bag or seat. It seems to me, that this is one of the best
>ways to encourage cycling.

I'm trying to think of anything that I did because of a bumper sticker.

>... I look at it this way. I have to read some
>very stupid bumper stickers, so why not display my own message.

I'm with you there. I got my own stupid bumper sticker. It's an edited
"Moose.. your life" from
<http://www.wildlife.state.nh.us/Logos/BFM_bumper_sticker2.gif >

--
mac the na�f

Date: 24 Apr 2007 19:54:08
From: Mike Kruger
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

Alex Colvin wrote:
>> I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message
>> on their back, bag or seat. It seems to me, that this is one of the
>> best ways to encourage cycling.
>
> I'm trying to think of anything that I did because of a bumper
> sticker.
>
Not even "Honk if you're Horny?"

Date: 24 Apr 2007 08:17:42
From: landotter
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 23, 11:42 pm, oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_ha...@comcast.net >
wrote:
> I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
> their back, bag or seat. It seems to me, that this is one of the best
> ways to encourage cycling.

No, it's a way to look smug and self satisfied, like all of your other
bogus "products". The best way to encourage cycling is to simply do so
in normal clothes so folks can think, "hey that looks like fun!",
instead of, "fuck that nasty hippie, thank Jebus for my Lexus."

Date: 24 Apr 2007 05:05:34
From: joseph.santaniello@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 24, 6:42 am, oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_ha...@comcast.net >
wrote:
> I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
> their back, bag or seat. It seems to me, that this is one of the best
> ways to encourage cycling. I look at it this way. I have to read some
> very stupid bumper stickers, so why not display my own message. Plus,
> my message is more readable than a bumper sticker, since I have a
> larger surface area.
> ----
> Jim Gagnepainhttp://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

The problem with messages, is that the vast majority just ignore the
message by assuming the messenger is a wack-o. Perhaps the thing to do
would be to cycle around in a Brooks Brothers suit.

Joseph

Date: 24 Apr 2007 16:30:25
From: Leo Lichtman
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

<joseph.santaniello@gmail.com > wrote: (clip)Perhaps the thing to do would
be to cycle around in a Brooks Brothers suit.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
The best of both worlds: A Brooks Brothers suit with a message on the back.
How about a Brooks Brothers suit with, "This space deliberately left blank"?

Date: 24 Apr 2007 06:27:08
From: DI
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

"oilfreeandhappy" <oil_free_and_happy@comcast.net > wrote in message
news:1177389775.292995.319610@s33g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
>I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
> their back, bag or seat. It seems to me, that this is one of the best
> ways to encourage cycling. I look at it this way. I have to read some
> very stupid bumper stickers, so why not display my own message. Plus,
> my message is more readable than a bumper sticker, since I have a
> larger surface area.
> ----
> Jim Gagnepain
> http://www.OilFreeandHappy.com
>

And please buy my T-Shirts!

Date: 24 Apr 2007 17:34:49
From: PoweredbySweat
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

Date: 24 Apr 2007 01:55:11
From: Sir Ridesalot
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Apr 24, 12:42 am, oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_ha...@comcast.net >
wrote:
> I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
> their back, bag or seat. It seems to me, that this is one of the best
> ways to encourage cycling. I look at it this way. I have to read some
> very stupid bumper stickers, so why not display my own message. Plus,
> my message is more readable than a bumper sticker, since I have a
> larger surface area.
> ----
> Jim Gagnepainhttp://www.OilFreeandHappy.com

Hi there.

How about:

This Vehicle Runs On Bananas And Water

or

This Vehicle Gets 50 Kms/Banana

or

Eating 2 Many Bananas = Jet Propulsion

Cheers from Peter

Date: 26 Apr 2007 15:49:59
From: Mark Mitchell
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On 2007-04-24, Sir Ridesalot <i_am_cycle_pathic@yahoo.ca > wrote:
> On Apr 24, 12:42 am, oilfreeandhappy <oil_free_and_ha...@comcast.net>
> wrote:
>> I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
>> their back, bag or seat. It seems to me, that this is one of the best
>> ways to encourage cycling. I look at it this way. I have to read some
>> very stupid bumper stickers, so why not display my own message. Plus,
>> my message is more readable than a bumper sticker, since I have a
>> larger surface area.
>> ----
>> Jim Gagnepainhttp://www.OilFreeandHappy.com
>
>
> Hi there.
>
> How about:
>
> This Vehicle Runs On Bananas And Water
>
> or
>
> This Vehicle Gets 50 Kms/Banana
>
> or
>
> Eating 2 Many Bananas = Jet Propulsion
>
> Cheers from Peter
>
20 miles to the beer.

How would you rather fill up?

Mark

Date: 24 Apr 2007 11:51:12
From: catzz66
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

Sir Ridesalot wrote:
> On Apr 24, 12:42 am, oilfree...
>
>

Nothing wrong with trying to make a buck, but the primary point of the
thread (attempt) to sell more tshirts for this guy. My message is
delivered by my actions, getting out and riding nearly every day and not
intentionally annoying people in the process. It is really absurd to
say you are oil free. Nobody is oil free if they are consumers of any
products at all, including bikes.

Date: 23 Apr 2007 23:03:30
From: Bill Sornson
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

oilfreeandhappy wrote:
> I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
> their back, bag or seat.

Umm... I kinda think that RIDING MY BIKE is sorta pro-cycling.

Bill "YMMV?" S.

Date: 24 Apr 2007 08:56:24
From: Dane Buson
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

Bill Sornson <askme@ask.me > wrote:
> oilfreeandhappy wrote:
>> I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
>> their back, bag or seat.
>
> Umm... I kinda think that RIDING MY BIKE is sorta pro-cycling.

That was what I was thinking. The old saw of teaching by being the
example, instead of preaching to the disinterested.

--
Dane Buson - sigdane@unixbigots.org
"When passenger of foot heave in sight, tootle the horn.
Trumpet him melodiously at first, but if he still
obstacles your passage then tootle him with vigor."
-From a brochure of a car rental firm in Tokyo

Date: 24 Apr 2007 16:46:58
From: Matt O'Toole
Subject: Re: Does Anybody Else Display a Message?

On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 08:56:24 -0700, Dane Buson wrote:

> Bill Sornson <askme@ask.me> wrote:

>> oilfreeandhappy wrote:

>>> I have seen very few cyclists displaying a cycling advocacy message on
>>> their back, bag or seat.

>> Umm... I kinda think that RIDING MY BIKE is sorta pro-cycling.

> That was what I was thinking. The old saw of teaching by being the
> example, instead of preaching to the disinterested.

I agree.

I also don't think it's helpful to imply that riding your bike is some
sort of gesture.

Matt O.