Never seen this before - anyone else?

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Date: 06 Mar 2007 20:54:57
From: brink
Subject: Never seen this before - anyone else?

Out in Riverside, Calif., the city has made a change to one its roads - and
it's recent from what I can tell.

There is now a solid-striped lane on the far right of Magnolia Avenue
approaching downtown. Every several hundred feet, it is signed with *three*
advisory signs:

1) a red-and-white "NO PARKING 7am-9am or 4pm-6pm"

2) a black-and-white "BIKE LANE 7am-9am and 4pm-6pm"

3) a green-and-white "ONE HOUR PARKING 9am-4pm"

Now that is a first... a *restricted* bike lane... restricted by time like
one would often see an HOV lane.

What will they think of next? Anyone ever see one of these before?

brink

Date: 08 Mar 2007 13:19:49
From:
Subject: Re: Never seen this before - anyone else?

On 8, 8:18 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo" <p...@vecchios.com >
wrote:
>
>
> Step in the right direction. People don't ride because there are no
> consistently safe places to ride, whether they do it for 'fun' or
> commuting.

I'd correct that. Instead, people don't ride (partly) because they
THINK there are no consistently safe places to ride. In my
experience, they're usually wrong. And the addition of a bike lane
stripe doesn't help safety anyway...

... even though most people think it does.

It's sort of a conundrum, isn't it? "Here's a measure that doesn't
help you, and my hurt you, but it'll make you feel safer. Remember to
vote for me in the next election!"

- Frank Krygowski

Date: 08 Mar 2007 16:50:43
From: Bill Baka
Subject: Re: Never seen this before - anyone else?

frkrygow@gmail.com wrote:
> On 8, 8:18 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo" <p...@vecchios.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> Step in the right direction. People don't ride because there are no
>> consistently safe places to ride, whether they do it for 'fun' or
>> commuting.
>
> I'd correct that. Instead, people don't ride (partly) because they
> THINK there are no consistently safe places to ride. In my
> experience, they're usually wrong. And the addition of a bike lane
> stripe doesn't help safety anyway...
>
> ... even though most people think it does.
>
> It's sort of a conundrum, isn't it? "Here's a measure that doesn't
> help you, and my hurt you, but it'll make you feel safer. Remember to
> vote for me in the next election!"
>
> - Frank Krygowski
>
Hey, people!
One of the main reasons I ride, other than fitness and freedom from gas
is to ***EXPLORE*** and find new places to ride. Staying withing a 40
mile radius of my house gives me a roughly 80 mile diameter area that I
have not yet explored even 25% of. That's 5,026 square miles of
potential riding area. If I have to go 40 miles from home to find
someplace new I just go into Fred mode and put the racks on the back and
maybe even wear a backpack full of food, tools, etc. Sometimes it is a
sunup to sundown trip in the summer but it makes a great weekend
getaway. On the fringes it turns into 80 miles plus exploring, but that
only makes for a leisurely poking around kind of Century plus.
It keeps me motivated to go new places.
I think that makes me the lucky one to live in the country.
When I lived in the city I got cultured out, ran out of museums, etc.
Now I never know what I can run into.
Bill Baka

Date: 08 Mar 2007 05:18:04
From: Qui si parla Campagnolo
Subject: Re: Never seen this before - anyone else?

On 6, 9:54 pm, "brink" <b...@invalid.invalid > wrote:
> Out in Riverside, Calif., the city has made a change to one its roads - and
> it's recent from what I can tell.
>
> There is now a solid-striped lane on the far right of Magnolia Avenue
> approaching downtown. Every several hundred feet, it is signed with *three*
> advisory signs:
>
> 1) a red-and-white "NO PARKING 7am-9am or 4pm-6pm"
>
> 2) a black-and-white "BIKE LANE 7am-9am and 4pm-6pm"
>
> 3) a green-and-white "ONE HOUR PARKING 9am-4pm"
>
> Now that is a first... a *restricted* bike lane... restricted by time like
> one would often see an HOV lane.
>
> What will they think of next? Anyone ever see one of these before?
>
> brink

Step in the right direction. People don't ride because there are no
consistently safe places to ride, whether they do it for 'fun' or
commuting. The 'oil free, no carbon footprint' lollies can whine all
they want about bad ole cars but until bicycles have a lane system of
their own, it ain't gonna happen, and lanes ain't gonna happen soon.

Date: 07 Mar 2007 18:36:41
From: fluffy bunny
Subject: Re: Never seen this before - anyone else?

In article <556vkuF23khs1U1@mid.individual.net >,
"brink" <brink@invalid.invalid > wrote:

> Out in Riverside, Calif., the city has made a change to one its roads - and
> it's recent from what I can tell.
>
> There is now a solid-striped lane on the far right of Magnolia Avenue
> approaching downtown. Every several hundred feet, it is signed with *three*
> advisory signs:
>
> 1) a red-and-white "NO PARKING 7am-9am or 4pm-6pm"
>
> 2) a black-and-white "BIKE LANE 7am-9am and 4pm-6pm"
>
> 3) a green-and-white "ONE HOUR PARKING 9am-4pm"
>
> Now that is a first... a *restricted* bike lane... restricted by time like
> one would often see an HOV lane.
>
> What will they think of next? Anyone ever see one of these before?
>
> brink

I'd be very interested to learn how many tickets and/or tows happen to
parked cars during the bike lane hours. Please keep us posted.

.max

Date: 07 Mar 2007 12:02:48
From: David L. Johnson
Subject: Re: Never seen this before - anyone else?

brink wrote:
> Out in Riverside, Calif., the city has made a change to one its roads - and
> it's recent from what I can tell.
>
> There is now a solid-striped lane on the far right of Magnolia Avenue
> approaching downtown. Every several hundred feet, it is signed with *three*
> advisory signs:
>
> 1) a red-and-white "NO PARKING 7am-9am or 4pm-6pm"
>
> 2) a black-and-white "BIKE LANE 7am-9am and 4pm-6pm"
>
> 3) a green-and-white "ONE HOUR PARKING 9am-4pm"
>
> Now that is a first... a *restricted* bike lane... restricted by time like
> one would often see an HOV lane.

I agree that bike lanes in general are counter-productive, especially
near intersections. In Pennsylvania, the bike lane stripe is often
dashed at intersections, indicating that cars are allowed there, just
when things get interesting. Even worse are the cyclists who turn left
from one of these lanes, or drivers who believe that cyclists have to do
that.

We do have to recognize that cyclists will not be treated as equals on
the road to motorists. They will try to pass without changing lanes,
and will do that on blind curves. Rather than a bike lane resulting in
chaos at every intersection, perhaps somewhat wider travel lanes will
allow bikes and cars to coexist on city streets. Or will that just lead
to wider Hummers?

--

David L. Johnson

Enron's slogan: Respect, Communication, Integrity, and Excellence.

Date: 07 Mar 2007 07:05:13
From: Diablo Scott
Subject: Re: Never seen this before - anyone else?

Date: 07 Mar 2007 02:53:25
From: Rich Clark
Subject: Re: Never seen this before - anyone else?

"brink" <brink@invalid.invalid > wrote in message
news:556vkuF23khs1U1@mid.individual.net...
> Out in Riverside, Calif., the city has made a change to one its roads -
> and it's recent from what I can tell.
>
> There is now a solid-striped lane on the far right of Magnolia Avenue
> approaching downtown. Every several hundred feet, it is signed with
> *three* advisory signs:
>
> 1) a red-and-white "NO PARKING 7am-9am or 4pm-6pm"
>
> 2) a black-and-white "BIKE LANE 7am-9am and 4pm-6pm"
>
> 3) a green-and-white "ONE HOUR PARKING 9am-4pm"
>
> Now that is a first... a *restricted* bike lane... restricted by time
> like one would often see an HOV lane.
>
> What will they think of next? Anyone ever see one of these before?

Huh. I would hope that the introduction of these is accompanied by an
aggressive PR campaign to remind drivers that bikes have a right to the
normal lanes too.

My priy objection to bike lanes is their segregationist effects: many
drivers truly believe that bikes are legal on the road only if there's a
separate lane for them, and otherwise belong on the sidewalk.

That said, I would have to know the road before judging whether this
approach is a good thing. In Philadelphia there are a number of streets
where parking is prohibited during rush hour. Drivers ignore bike lanes now
(and the police never, ever, enforce any bike-related infraction by either
drivers or cyclists), so I doubt that dedicating the parking lanes to bikes
during rush hours would do anything except raise the hostility level even
more.

R

Date: 07 Mar 2007 01:47:37
From: brink
Subject: Re: Never seen this before - anyone else?

"Rich Clark" <rdclark2SPAM@TRAPcomcast.net > wrote in message
news:SLCdnTOLM-Dr8nPYnZ2dneKdnZydnZ2d@comcast.com...
>
> "brink" <brink@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
> news:556vkuF23khs1U1@mid.individual.net...
>> Out in Riverside, Calif., the city has made a change to one its roads -
>> and it's recent from what I can tell.
>>
>> There is now a solid-striped lane on the far right of Magnolia Avenue
>> approaching downtown. Every several hundred feet, it is signed with
>> *three* advisory signs:
>>
>> 1) a red-and-white "NO PARKING 7am-9am or 4pm-6pm"
>>
>> 2) a black-and-white "BIKE LANE 7am-9am and 4pm-6pm"
>>
>> 3) a green-and-white "ONE HOUR PARKING 9am-4pm"
>>
>> Now that is a first... a *restricted* bike lane... restricted by time
>> like one would often see an HOV lane.
>>
>> What will they think of next? Anyone ever see one of these before?
>
> Huh. I would hope that the introduction of these is accompanied by an
> aggressive PR campaign to remind drivers that bikes have a right to the
> normal lanes too.
>
> My priy objection to bike lanes is their segregationist effects: many
> drivers truly believe that bikes are legal on the road only if there's a
> separate lane for them, and otherwise belong on the sidewalk.

Agreed. My worry is that drivers -- in their ignorance -- would interpret
this as "cyclists allowed on roads -- in their lane only of course -- during
those posted hours." I'm going to do an informal poll out here with people
in Riverside and see how they interpret this...

> That said, I would have to know the road before judging whether this
> approach is a good thing. In Philadelphia there are a number of streets
> where parking is prohibited during rush hour. Drivers ignore bike lanes
> now (and the police never, ever, enforce any bike-related infraction by
> either drivers or cyclists), so I doubt that dedicating the parking lanes
> to bikes during rush hours would do anything except raise the hostility
> level even more.

Perhaps. This isn't a super-urban area like Philly, so parking isn't a
major premium. Course I was still a couple miles out of downtown when I
observed this new lane, closer to downtown that changes, esp now that
they've completely done away with free parking downtown.

I'll see if I can snap some photos of this. I still can't quite get my head
around this seeming innovation. I'm going to try to call Riverside's
transportation dept tomorrow to get their take on the why and how they
implemented this.

brink

Date: 07 Mar 2007 06:38:49
From: Bill Baka
Subject: Re: Never seen this before - anyone else?