| |
Main
Date: 07 Nov 2007 13:19:38
From: Sandy
Subject: End point in WADA game
|
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2007/nov07/nov07news
Luc Mission has finally hit on the essential point. Uci should now die a
stormy death. And WADA.
--
Sandy
--
C'est le contraire du vélo, la bicyclette.
Une silhouette profilée mauve fluo dévale
à soixante-dix à l'heure : c'est du vélo.
Deux lycéennes côte à côte traversent
un pont à Bruges : c'est de la bicyclette.
-Delerm, P.
|
|
| |
Date: 10 Nov 2007 08:20:21
From: Jeff Jones
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
On Nov 7, 7:54 pm, benn.trov...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Nov 7, 10:19 am, "Sandy" <leur...@free.fr> wrote:
>
> >http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2007/nov07/nov07news
>
> > Luc Mission has finally hit on the essential point. Uci should now die a
> > stormy death. And WADA.
> > --
>
> Can you predict the consequences of their disappearance?
I'll have a stab: both organisations will be replaced by ones that are
directly linked to government. Or the UCI and WADA rebuild themselves
to this effect.
I don't think the anti-doping movement will stop, however. According
to the unerring legal reference, Wikipedia, there is an anti-doping
convention with legal status that was set out by the Council of Europe
in 1989 (not to be confused with the European Council or the Council
of the European Union :-). So one would think that a Son of WADA
could be set up with this convention as a basis. WADA's current Anti-
Doping Code doesn't have international law status.
Jeff
|
| | |
Date: 10 Nov 2007 07:24:49
From: Sandy
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
Dans le message de
news:1194682821.294381.35610@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com,
Jeff Jones <drjones99@gmail.com > a réfléchi, et puis a déclaré :
> On Nov 7, 7:54 pm, benn.trov...@hotmail.com wrote:
>> On Nov 7, 10:19 am, "Sandy" <leur...@free.fr> wrote:
>>
>>> http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2007/nov07/nov07news
>>
>>> Luc Mission has finally hit on the essential point. Uci should
>>> now die a stormy death. And WADA.
>>> --
>>
>> Can you predict the consequences of their disappearance?
>
> I'll have a stab: both organisations will be replaced by ones that are
> directly linked to government. Or the UCI and WADA rebuild themselves
> to this effect.
>
> I don't think the anti-doping movement will stop, however. According
> to the unerring legal reference, Wikipedia, there is an anti-doping
> convention with legal status that was set out by the Council of Europe
> in 1989 (not to be confused with the European Council or the Council
> of the European Union :-). So one would think that a Son of WADA
> could be set up with this convention as a basis. WADA's current Anti-
> Doping Code doesn't have international law status.
>
> Jeff
You certainly are following the issue, but it's somewhat frightening, don't
you think? The only parallel to such an administration is the international
war crimes tribunal, which takes responsibility for prosecuting contemporary
devils. To think how cycling has moved up in the food chain of evildoing!
Takes your breath away. It will outrank the little inconveniences like gun
running, environmental polluting, and money laundering, all of which will
still only be single or dual jurisdiction crimes. That is the WADA
potential.
On the other hand, UCI is really in a jam. So would be other sports
federations, if they allowed this doping stuff to be taken seriously.
There, the major threat comes from the EU in Brussels and the Competition
commission. You may have noted that France has already been strongarmed
into giving up the national monopoly on gambling (just a wee bit late for
Unibet). But it is quite clear that ASO is also playing at the edges, as it
is a near monopoly for the old continent. UFOLEP is hardly a competitor in
France.
It all warms the cockles of my lawyer's heart. (Yes, a blood pumping organ,
not a center of tender emotion.)
--
Sandy
-
Darwinism, born in ideological struggle, has never escaped from an intimate
reciprocal relationship with worldviews exported from and imported into the
science. No one challenges the claim that evolutionary theory has had a wide
effect on social theory. It is a cliché of cultural history that the
explanation of evolution by natural selection served as an ideological
justification for laissez-faire capitalism and the colonial domination of
the lesser breeds without the law
- Richard Lewontin
|
| | |
Date: 10 Nov 2007 11:09:52
From:
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
* Jeff Jones <***@gmail.com > a écrit profondement:
|
| | | |
Date: 10 Nov 2007 15:23:12
From: Tom Kunich
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
<Davey@Crockett.Net > wrote in message news:87hcju1ken.fsf@azurservers.com...
>* Jeff Jones <***@gmail.com> a écrit profondement:
>
|
| | | | |
Date: 11 Nov 2007 00:51:58
From:
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
* "Tom Kunich" <***@yahoo. com > a écrit profondement:
|
| | | | | |
Date: 10 Nov 2007 17:47:59
From: Tom Kunich
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
<Davey@Crockett.Net > wrote in message news:87zlxlek0x.fsf@azurservers.com...
>* "Tom Kunich" <***@yahoo. com> a écrit profondement:
>
|
| |
Date: 09 Nov 2007 02:52:24
From: amit.ghosh@gmail.com
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
I should've said :
> This is similar to certain jobs, where if you work in a certain
> shop it is mandatory that you are a member of the union and work under
> a collective agreement.
|
| |
Date: 09 Nov 2007 02:46:51
From: amit.ghosh@gmail.com
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
On Nov 8, 8:49 am, "Sandy" <leur...@free.fr > wrote:
> Dans le message denews:1194476734.828562.180580@v23g2000prn.googlegroups.=
com,
> b...@mambo.ucolick.org <b...@mambo.ucolick.org> a r=E9fl=E9chi, et puis a=
d=E9clar=E9
> :
>
>
>
> > On Nov 7, 11:19 am, "Sandy" <leur...@free.fr> wrote:
> >>http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=3Dnews/2007/nov07/nov07news
>
> >> Luc Mission has finally hit on the essential point. Uci should now
> >> die a stormy death. And WADA.
>
> > "According to Misson, it should not be obligatory to hold a licence
> > in order to work and each person is entitled to an independent and
> > impartial jurisdiction when being punished."
>
> > I don't think much of UCI and WADA, but come on. The second
> > half of this sentence is fine, but the first half is dreaming. At
> > least
> > in the US, you gotta be licensed to be a tradesman: plumber,
> > contractor, exterminator. To say nothing of all the professional
> > trades. You need a license to be a lawyer (only they don't call
> > it a license, to avoid sounding like tradesmen). If you violate
> > the ethical code of lawyering, you can lose your license, even
> > if the violation is not sufficient to put you in jail.
>
> If you look at it just a little differently, you will see Misson's point.
>
There's more than one possible analogy, so I don't think that Ben's
analogy captures all the issues.
The UCI isn't the only governing body of cycling, but it requires that
participants in the races it sanctions hold a UCI license. So it's
like a club or a league. In theory one can still be a professional
rider without a UCI license.
This is in contrast to certain jobs, where if you work in a certain
shop it is mandatory that you are a member of the union and work under
a collective agreement.
Misson might (should) argue that it's not legal to force riders who
are "employed" by UCI races to have to honour to a contract they
didn't have a part in negotiating.
|
| |
Date: 07 Nov 2007 21:20:48
From: bjw@mambo.ucolick.org
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
On Nov 7, 11:19 am, "Sandy" <leur...@free.fr > wrote:
> http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2007/nov07/nov07news
>
> Luc Mission has finally hit on the essential point. Uci should now die a
> stormy death. And WADA.
"According to Misson, it should not be obligatory to hold a licence
in order to work and each person is entitled to an independent and
impartial jurisdiction when being punished."
I don't think much of UCI and WADA, but come on. The second
half of this sentence is fine, but the first half is dreaming. At
least
in the US, you gotta be licensed to be a tradesman: plumber,
contractor, exterminator. To say nothing of all the professional
trades. You need a license to be a lawyer (only they don't call
it a license, to avoid sounding like tradesmen). If you violate
the ethical code of lawyering, you can lose your license, even
if the violation is not sufficient to put you in jail.
You don't need a license to be a rock star, and there isn't
an ethical code. So maybe if we all recognize that bicycle
racers are pure entertainment like rock stars, Misson is
correct. But he should argue on that basis, not inventing
new human rights like the right to be employed without
taking any responsibility for one's own actions, even though
those actions might be detrimental to one's fellow tradesmen.
Ben
|
| | |
Date: 08 Nov 2007 08:49:11
From: Sandy
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
Dans le message de
news:1194476734.828562.180580@v23g2000prn.googlegroups.com,
bjw@mambo.ucolick.org <bjw@mambo.ucolick.org > a réfléchi, et puis a déclaré
:
> On Nov 7, 11:19 am, "Sandy" <leur...@free.fr> wrote:
>> http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2007/nov07/nov07news
>>
>> Luc Mission has finally hit on the essential point. Uci should now
>> die a stormy death. And WADA.
>
> "According to Misson, it should not be obligatory to hold a licence
> in order to work and each person is entitled to an independent and
> impartial jurisdiction when being punished."
>
> I don't think much of UCI and WADA, but come on. The second
> half of this sentence is fine, but the first half is dreaming. At
> least
> in the US, you gotta be licensed to be a tradesman: plumber,
> contractor, exterminator. To say nothing of all the professional
> trades. You need a license to be a lawyer (only they don't call
> it a license, to avoid sounding like tradesmen). If you violate
> the ethical code of lawyering, you can lose your license, even
> if the violation is not sufficient to put you in jail.
If you look at it just a little differently, you will see Misson's point.
The licenses you write about are issued not by the trades but by the
government.
One qualifies and gets a license. One sins and loses it.
All these decisions are made by the civil or criminal authorities, not by an
independent, rogue, private money-making organization.
The point is that interposing several layers of Quangos and NGO's forms a
barrier between the individual and governmental authority.
Repeating - UCI is a for-profit non-profit entity, as it operates, no matter
what the charter reads. And it is not the organ of the government which
should be regulating.
--
Sandy
--
Mobilité et stabilité ne sont pas antinomiques :
un cycliste n'est stable sur sa bicyclette
qu'en avançant.
- Chirac, J (who must have read Einstein)
|
| | |
Date: 08 Nov 2007 10:16:26
From:
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
* "bjw@mambo.ucolick.org" <***@mambo.ucolick.org" <bjw@mambo.ucolick.org > a écrit profondement:
|
| | | |
Date: 09 Nov 2007 06:55:05
From: Tom Kunich
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
<Davey@Crockett.Net > wrote in message news:87ejf16qs5.fsf@azurservers.com...
>* "bjw@mambo.ucolick.org" <***@mambo.ucolick.org" <bjw@mambo.ucolick.org> a
>écrit profondement:
>
>
|
| |
Date: 07 Nov 2007 14:53:52
From: Colin Campbell
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
Sandy wrote:
> http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2007/nov07/nov07news
>
> Luc Mission has finally hit on the essential point. Uci should now die a
> stormy death. And WADA.
There was an even more interesting headline at the bottom:
"Kaka to represent South Africa"
|
| |
Date: 07 Nov 2007 11:54:37
From:
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
On Nov 7, 10:19 am, "Sandy" <leur...@free.fr > wrote:
> http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2007/nov07/nov07news
>
> Luc Mission has finally hit on the essential point. Uci should now die a
> stormy death. And WADA.
> --
Can you predict the consequences of their disappearance?
|
| | |
Date: 07 Nov 2007 15:32:52
From: Sandy
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
Dans le message de
news:1194465277.806363.321620@o38g2000hse.googlegroups.com,
benn.trovato@hotmail.com <benn.trovato@hotmail.com > a réfléchi, et puis a
déclaré :
> On Nov 7, 10:19 am, "Sandy" <leur...@free.fr> wrote:
>> http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2007/nov07/nov07news
>>
>> Luc Mission has finally hit on the essential point. Uci should now
>> die a stormy death. And WADA.
>> --
>
> Can you predict the consequences of their disappearance?
Of course.
|
| |
Date: 07 Nov 2007 10:32:08
From: Bill C
Subject: Re: End point in WADA game
|
On Nov 7, 1:19 pm, "Sandy" <leur...@free.fr > wrote:
> http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=3Dnews/2007/nov07/nov07news
>
> Luc Mission has finally hit on the essential point. Uci should now die a
> stormy death. And WADA.
> --
> Sandy
> --
> C'est le contraire du v=E9lo, la bicyclette.
> Une silhouette profil=E9e mauve fluo d=E9vale
> =E0 soixante-dix =E0 l'heure : c'est du v=E9lo.
> Deux lyc=E9ennes c=F4te =E0 c=F4te traversent
> un pont =E0 Bruges : c'est de la bicyclette.
> -Delerm, P.
Got the fingers crossed.
Bill C
|
|
