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Date: 24 Apr 2006 21:03:47
From: NYC XYZ
Subject: DT Swiss SSD 225 Rear Air Shock
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Say, anyone know anything about this thingamajig?
I was just about to adjust it WRT air pressure and damping. So I
released all the air. Now the thing won't pump back up!
Unless I have a defective air shock pump, the shock itself must be
broken somehow!
The mechanic who'd installed it at the shop said to put some WD-40 on
it, but no luck...if anything, it seems to be even worse off! By "it"
I mean that business end of the whole piston-looking contraption, that
part which goes in and out of the air chamber. After a bit of WD-40,
it hardly extends at all.
Any ideas WTF is going on????
I'm taking the unit to an LBS to see if they can figure it out, but in
the meantime, no ride!
Worst of all, there's no manual for this particular model air shock
from DT Swiss, and their site is pretty but of no help.
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Date: 06 Jul 2006 05:35:53
From: Lyle Beaulac
Subject: Re: DT Swiss SSD 225 Rear Air Shock
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NYC XYZ wrote:
> Say, anyone know anything about this thingamajig?
>
> I was just about to adjust it WRT air pressure and damping. So I
> released all the air. Now the thing won't pump back up!
>
> Unless I have a defective air shock pump, the shock itself must be
> broken somehow!
>
> The mechanic who'd installed it at the shop said to put some WD-40 on
> it, but no luck...if anything, it seems to be even worse off! By "it"
> I mean that business end of the whole piston-looking contraption, that
> part which goes in and out of the air chamber. After a bit of WD-40,
> it hardly extends at all.
>
> Any ideas WTF is going on????
>
> I'm taking the unit to an LBS to see if they can figure it out, but in
> the meantime, no ride!
>
> Worst of all, there's no manual for this particular model air shock
> from DT Swiss, and their site is pretty but of no help.
>
I think I had the same thing on my Grasshopper when I bought it. The
shock would retract *hard* when I let the air out, like there was a
strong spring forcing it shut. This was not how it was supposed to work!
It took over 120 psi just to get the piston to start extending..
I sent a few pictures to DT, who graciously sent me a replacement
providing I returned the defective unit. I had asked them to email me
when they found out what the problem was, but never heard from them. I
had thought mine was an isolated incident, but now it sounds like there
may be a more widespread problem.
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Date: 26 Apr 2006 12:36:27
From: NYC XYZ
Subject: Re: DT Swiss SSD 225 Rear Air Shock
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Peter Clinch wrote:
>
>
> A teensy bit, but as long as you're spinning at a high cadence
> rather than mashing it's incredibly good in that respect. If you
> have a chance to ride along behind and look at how the back wheel
> moves up and down over minor bumps but the rack stays /very/ still
> I think you'll be quite impressed.
Ah, yes, can't wait! A nice video camera is in the future later this
year...I'd love to post it somewhere once I get it on tape!
> As well as the fairly sophisticated suspension design you've got
> the fact that you're pushing forwards rather than down, so there's
> less tendency to pogo than on an upwrong in the first place.
Yes, good point. But it just seemed like an interesting option to give
my ride, that's all. I didn't expect to use it much.
> Next point, unless it's particularly good pavement you'll lose the
> efficiency /gain/ from suspension. Any bump you go over with
> suspension menas that the only thing that has to move up is the
> wheel and unsprung bits of frame/fork. With it locked out,
> anything you go over requires the whole bike and the rider to be
> shifted up, which loses you a lot of energy. Probably more than
> any pogo effect will lose.
Yes, that's sounds very likely. Again, it's more of a novelty thing
than anything else. Like I was saying, I guess I'll just "build" a
comfort DF featuring that 210 shock instead of putting it on the SMGTe.
> Plus you've payed all that money for top of the line comfort and
> now you're throwing it away! Get a Bachetta if you want a no-fuss
> rigid tarmac burner.
True. It's just a toy, really, kinda like having your Mac (cough)
running both OS X and Windows.
> Very few such machines. Why not just get a Moulton or something
> like that, designed from the ground up to be fully suspended with
> the suspension optimised for the road.
Hmm. On second thought, I really don't have that much time for all
this anyway!
The SMGTe is a beautiful ride. Not as fast as I'd like, but I knew
that -- for a 5mph penalty, I am 95% comfortable.
Can't wait to do a real tour on it next year! I'm already looking at
the annual 8-day Errie Canal ride...would also be interested in
Montreal's annual get-together, but this being the USA, I won't have
enough paid leave for both!
> Pete.
> --
> Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
> Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
> Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
> net p.j.clinch@dundee.ac.uk http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
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Date: 26 Apr 2006 09:23:58
From: NYC XYZ
Subject: Re: DT Swiss SSD 225 Rear Air Shock
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Peter Clinch wrote:
>
>
> So you get something which doesn't work properly and means you can't
> ride, and you use that as a basis to buy from them next time...?
I was rather impressed with the customer service. Unless things I buy
from them keep malfunctioning, it's nice to know that I have the
company behind me.
> Why would you want to do that? It's quite useful on MTBs to stop
> climbing pogo but you've already got that pretty much nailed through the
> No-Squat geometry of the suspension design. You'd just be paying more
> money for something of no particular use.
Well, surely there's *some* slight "pogo"...it's a shock, after all, it
can't be as rigid as a for-real hard-tail ride....
Anyway, I was just curious. Perhaps I'll build a DF comfort bike with
it! Basically, take some nice hybrid frame that allows for rear
suspension...such a shock would allow me to take it easy or ride "more
athletically," depending on how I feel....
> Pete.
> --
> Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
> Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
> Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
> net p.j.clinch@dundee.ac.uk http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
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Date: 26 Apr 2006 20:27:09
From: Peter Clinch
Subject: Re: DT Swiss SSD 225 Rear Air Shock
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NYC XYZ wrote:
>
> Well, surely there's *some* slight "pogo"...it's a shock, after all, it
> can't be as rigid as a for-real hard-tail ride....
A teensy bit, but as long as you're spinning at a high cadence
rather than mashing it's incredibly good in that respect. If you
have a chance to ride along behind and look at how the back wheel
moves up and down over minor bumps but the rack stays /very/ still
I think you'll be quite impressed.
As well as the fairly sophisticated suspension design you've got
the fact that you're pushing forwards rather than down, so there's
less tendency to pogo than on an upwrong in the first place.
Next point, unless it's particularly good pavement you'll lose the
efficiency /gain/ from suspension. Any bump you go over with
suspension menas that the only thing that has to move up is the
wheel and unsprung bits of frame/fork. With it locked out,
anything you go over requires the whole bike and the rider to be
shifted up, which loses you a lot of energy. Probably more than
any pogo effect will lose.
Plus you've payed all that money for top of the line comfort and
now you're throwing it away! Get a Bachetta if you want a no-fuss
rigid tarmac burner.
> Anyway, I was just curious. Perhaps I'll build a DF comfort bike with
> it! Basically, take some nice hybrid frame that allows for rear
> suspension...
Very few such machines. Why not just get a Moulton or something
like that, designed from the ground up to be fully suspended with
the suspension optimised for the road.
Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net p.j.clinch@dundee.ac.uk http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
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Date: 26 Apr 2006 07:52:42
From: NYC XYZ
Subject: Re: DT Swiss SSD 225 Rear Air Shock
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gotbent wrote:
>
>
>
> I have a DT on one of my bents, too. It is quite simple. Air in,
> adjust damping knob. Ride and readjust damping to suite conditions,
> ride some more. Check air every few weeks. IIRC there is a manual on
> their site,
I hate it when I get something that shares a manual with another model
-- and, worse, the manual is really about that other model! The 210 is
the one to use for the 225 as well.
> or you could try calling the Hostel Shoppe where you bought
> the bike and ask them.
Heh...let's just say that DT Swiss (US) doesn't know why they sent
along the HVR 400 manual with that 225 SD....
> There's not much to fuck up. Can we assume that
> you are using a 'shock' quality pump capable of reaching pressures
> above 200 psi?
Yes, up to 300 psi, or 20 bar -- it's that pump that Hostel Shoppe
sells. Looks pretty flimsy and low-tech for $37, but it's still
cheaper than comparable makes from performancebike.com, etc.
> The whole shock can be rebuilt with a kit DT sells. IIRC
> the shock is built fail safe (except from tampering by morons).
Hmm...so "fail-safe" isn't "fool-proof"??
> If the
> air chamber fails, there is a polymeric spring inside that will
> continue working.
I must say that DT Swiss (US) has been very gracious so far...they sent
a UPS guy out to pick up the defective part (damned UPS guy showed up
at the wrong place and then left in a minute without picking up the
package -- now I'll have to go to a local office of theirs to get the
thing out today), and in the meantime I'm getting a replacement unit!
Very interesting experience...I'd buy DT Swiss for sure next time! As
a matter of fact, I'm already looking at their 210 model, which is a
225 with a lock-out...I wonder if that would work with the HP Velo
SMGTe -- the lock-out suspends the suspension, it turns it off, as it
were, so that the bike becomes a hard-tail!
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Date: 26 Apr 2006 16:25:20
From: Peter Clinch
Subject: Re: DT Swiss SSD 225 Rear Air Shock
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NYC XYZ wrote:
> Very interesting experience...I'd buy DT Swiss for sure next time!
So you get something which doesn't work properly and means you can't
ride, and you use that as a basis to buy from them next time...?
> a matter of fact, I'm already looking at their 210 model, which is a
> 225 with a lock-out...I wonder if that would work with the HP Velo
> SMGTe -- the lock-out suspends the suspension, it turns it off, as it
> were, so that the bike becomes a hard-tail!
Why would you want to do that? It's quite useful on MTBs to stop
climbing pogo but you've already got that pretty much nailed through the
No-Squat geometry of the suspension design. You'd just be paying more
money for something of no particular use.
Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net p.j.clinch@dundee.ac.uk http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
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Date: 26 Apr 2006 04:38:46
From: gotbent
Subject: Re: DT Swiss SSD 225 Rear Air Shock
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NYC XYZ wrote:
> Say, anyone know anything about this thingamajig?
>
> I was just about to adjust it WRT air pressure and damping. So I
> released all the air. Now the thing won't pump back up!
>
> Unless I have a defective air shock pump, the shock itself must be
> broken somehow!
>
> The mechanic who'd installed it at the shop said to put some WD-40 on
> it, but no luck...if anything, it seems to be even worse off! By "it"
> I mean that business end of the whole piston-looking contraption, that
> part which goes in and out of the air chamber. After a bit of WD-40,
> it hardly extends at all.
>
> Any ideas WTF is going on????
>
> I'm taking the unit to an LBS to see if they can figure it out, but in
> the meantime, no ride!
>
> Worst of all, there's no manual for this particular model air shock
> from DT Swiss, and their site is pretty but of no help.
I have a DT on one of my bents, too. It is quite simple. Air in,
adjust damping knob. Ride and readjust damping to suite conditions,
ride some more. Check air every few weeks. IIRC there is a manual on
their site, or you could try calling the Hostel Shoppe where you bought
the bike and ask them. There's not much to fuck up. Can we assume that
you are using a 'shock' quality pump capable of reaching pressures
above 200 psi? The whole shock can be rebuilt with a kit DT sells. IIRC
the shock is built fail safe (except from tampering by morons). If the
air chamber fails, there is a polymeric spring inside that will
continue working.
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