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Main
Date: 18 Sep 2005 12:59:40
From:
Subject: Q: Keeping up with the Jones
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I am (strongly) considering getting an ICE Micro trike for Christmas.
On club rides on my Trek diamond frame, I usually do about 12-14 MPH in
the pack without any stress/strain for 30-40 miles on relatively flat
terrain. (Finished a 38 mile ride today with the early group).
Have people who used both DFs and trikes experienced big differences in
speed between the two at the same physical effort? In other words, am I
going to hold back the pack with a trike at 12-14 MPH?
I know this is a loaded question and that all riders are different, but
what experiences have people had?
Thanks, Ralph
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Date: 29 Sep 2005 20:28:37
From: Sunset Lowracer [TM] Fanatic
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
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perryb67@yahoo.com wrote:
> The thread being talked about is Trike Drafting Technique at
> http://groups.google.com/group/alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent/browse_frm/thread/1f9b8cc2bff8d71f?q=http:%2F%2Fwww.crazyguyonabike.com%2F&hl=en&.
>
>
> Sunset Lowracer [TM] Fanatic wrote:
>
> > It is documented on alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent that I posted a picture
> > of a trike rider following a brown cat. Any judge would consider
> > claiming otherwise as libel.
>
> Yes Tommie, you did post "a picture of a trike rider following a brown
> cat." Unfortunately, that picture alternated with a pornographic
> picture. That is fact and is the reason why libel here is not
> involved.
It is libel when you state it was intentional on my part, when that is
obviously false.
> I remember crafting my response to your initial post to see if you
> really did not know there was an alternating picture. If you merely
> questioned, "What the hell are you talking about?" I figured you were
> innocent, however you went rather ballastic. It was your response that
> showed you really knew where this picture went.
If Perry Butler thinks this response
<http://groups.google.com/group/alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent/msg/a8ae3eacbcbf257c?dmode=source&hl=en >
is going ballistic, then he really is as much of an idiot as Ed Dolan
says he is.
> > I don't know who hacked the <http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/> website
> > to replace the proper picture with the one some claim was there [1]
> > (which never showed up for me, but obviously it was someone with some
> > computer knowledge. You wouldn't happen to know anyone like that would
> > you, Mr. Butler? Would you really want this matter investigated by the
> > legal authorities (I would welcome it since I have nothing to hide)?
>
> First of all, I would welcome the legal authorities to investigate who
> originally planted the alternating pictures. I know I didn't do it,
> and I also believe you probably didn't originally plant the picture.
> However, you did find it cute to post a link to it.
More libel from Perry Butler.
> > It should also be noted that Mr. Butler has a history of making
> > specious claims about the personal behavior of others on
> > alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent.
>
> Do you really want to go here Tommie? I'd be glad to!
I really don't recommend that you make a habit of spreading libel on a
public forum that is archived, Mr. Butler.
> > [1] Reputedly the "goatse" picture, a favorite former link on
> > rec.bicycles.racing.
>
> I find it amazing that you claim you have never seen the picture, but
> you seem to know what the picture is! This is another reason why I'm
> sure you knew the picture was there!
Are you a moron, Perry Butler? Someone else on the thread posted a
description of what the picture was
<http://groups.google.com/group/alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent/msg/d2fb1745aeaee964?dmode=source&hl=en >.
Duh! Just how stupid do you think we are?
> Enjoy,
>
> Perry B
>
> PS At least you had the common sense not to dispute your
> anal-retentive tendencies.
Do you teach your computer science students about online etiquette, Mr.
Butler? Maybe you should use some of your libelous posts as examples.
--
Tom Sherman
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Date: 29 Sep 2005 19:09:25
From:
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
The thread being talked about is Trike Drafting Technique at
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent/browse_frm/thread/1f9b8cc2bff8d71f?q=http:%2F%2Fwww.crazyguyonabike.com%2F&hl=en&.
Sunset Lowracer [TM] Fanatic wrote:
> It is documented on alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent that I posted a picture
> of a trike rider following a brown cat. Any judge would consider
> claiming otherwise as libel.
Yes Tommie, you did post "a picture of a trike rider following a brown
cat." Unfortunately, that picture alternated with a pornographic
picture. That is fact and is the reason why libel here is not
involved.
I remember crafting my response to your initial post to see if you
really did not know there was an alternating picture. If you merely
questioned, "What the hell are you talking about?" I figured you were
innocent, however you went rather ballastic. It was your response that
showed you really knew where this picture went.
> I don't know who hacked the <http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/> website
> to replace the proper picture with the one some claim was there [1]
> (which never showed up for me, but obviously it was someone with some
> computer knowledge. You wouldn't happen to know anyone like that would
> you, Mr. Butler? Would you really want this matter investigated by the
> legal authorities (I would welcome it since I have nothing to hide)?
First of all, I would welcome the legal authorities to investigate who
originally planted the alternating pictures. I know I didn't do it,
and I also believe you probably didn't originally plant the picture.
However, you did find it cute to post a link to it.
> It should also be noted that Mr. Butler has a history of making
> specious claims about the personal behavior of others on
> alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent.
Do you really want to go here Tommie? I'd be glad to!
> [1] Reputedly the "goatse" picture, a favorite former link on
> rec.bicycles.racing.
I find it amazing that you claim you have never seen the picture, but
you seem to know what the picture is! This is another reason why I'm
sure you knew the picture was there!
Enjoy,
Perry B
PS At least you had the common sense not to dispute your
anal-retentive tendencies.
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Date: 28 Sep 2005 04:00:45
From: Sunset Lowracer [TM] Fanatic
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
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perryb67@yahoo.com wrote:
> Tommie,
>
> You're quite anal-retentive on top posting, rans and now saab. You
> also originated a silly, needless post that directed us to a photo that
> every judge that I know would consider ponography. In your mind you
> probably actually thought you were funny. I guess if you deny any of
> these you'd be the one telling "lies" since all of this can be
> documented on ARBR.
It is documented on alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent that I posted a picture
of a trike rider following a brown cat. Any judge would consider
claiming otherwise as libel.
I don't know who hacked the <http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/ > website
to replace the proper picture with the one some claim was there [1]
(which never showed up for me, but obviously it was someone with some
computer knowledge. You wouldn't happen to know anyone like that would
you, Mr. Butler? Would you really want this matter investigated by the
legal authorities (I would welcome it since I have nothing to hide)?
It should also be noted that Mr. Butler has a history of making
specious claims about the personal behavior of others on
alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent.
[1] Reputedly the "goatse" picture, a favorite former link on
rec.bicycles.racing.
--
Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley
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Date: 27 Sep 2005 21:52:13
From:
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
Tommie,
You're quite anal-retentive on top posting, rans and now saab. You
also originated a silly, needless post that directed us to a photo that
every judge that I know would consider ponography. In your mind you
probably actually thought you were funny. I guess if you deny any of
these you'd be the one telling "lies" since all of this can be
documented on ARBR.
Enjoy,
Perry B
Sunset Lowracer [TM] Fanatic wrote:
> perry...@yahoo.com TOP POSTED:
> > Tommie, Eddie,
> >
> > My, My! It looks like the anal-retentive porn poster and the
> > anal-retentive liar have something in common!
>
> I see Perry Butler is still posting libelous statements (lies) about
> other people on alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent.
> --
> Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley
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Date: 24 Sep 2005 09:54:51
From: Sunset Lowracer [TM] Fanatic
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
perry...@yahoo.com TOP POSTED:
> Tommie, Eddie,
>
> My, My! It looks like the anal-retentive porn poster and the
> anal-retentive liar have something in common!
I see Perry Butler is still posting libelous statements (lies) about
other people on alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent.
--
Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley
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Date: 22 Sep 2005 14:57:11
From:
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
Tommie, Eddie,
My, My! It looks like the anal-retentive porn poster and the
anal-retentive liar have something in common!
Enjoy,
Perry B
Sunset Lowracer [TM] Fanatic wrote:
> Edward Dolan wrote:
> > ...
> > Since Perry Butler is a stickler about the exact burg where he is from, I
> > will forever and a day dictate that he is essentially from Alexandria,
> > Minnesota....
>
> I prefer to think of Mr. Butler's residence as BFE [1]. ;)
>
> [1] BFE: Beyond Freaking Evansville.
> --
> Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley
>
> "Mountain lions have always eaten humans, throughout our evolutionary
> history." - M.V.
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Date: 22 Sep 2005 17:12:31
From: Edward Dolan
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
<perryb67@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:1127426230.966319.267600@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> Tommie, Eddie,
>
> My, My! It looks like the anal-retentive porn poster and the
> anal-retentive liar have something in common!
>
> Enjoy,
>
> Perry B
Nothing but a name caller. This is what a Minnesota idiot reduces to when he
has run out of options.
--
Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota
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Date: 23 Sep 2005 08:56:52
From: Jeff Grippe
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
"Edward Dolan" <edolan@iw.net > wrote in message
news:nZ6dnRVxm7XPsa7eRVn-rA@prairiewave.com...
>
> <perryb67@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1127426230.966319.267600@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>> Tommie, Eddie,
>>
>> My, My! It looks like the anal-retentive porn poster and the
>> anal-retentive liar have something in common!
>>
>> Enjoy,
>>
>> Perry B
>
> Nothing but a name caller. This is what a Minnesota idiot reduces to when
> he has run out of options.
>
I believe there's an old saying about this. Something about pots and
kettles.
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Date: 21 Sep 2005 17:46:34
From: Sunset Lowracer [TM] Fanatic
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
Edward Dolan wrote:
> ...
> Since Perry Butler is a stickler about the exact burg where he is from, I
> will forever and a day dictate that he is essentially from Alexandria,
> Minnesota....
I prefer to think of Mr. Butler's residence as BFE [1]. ;)
[1] BFE: Beyond Freaking Evansville.
--
Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley
"Mountain lions have always eaten humans, throughout our evolutionary
history." - M.V.
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Date: 20 Sep 2005 19:35:21
From: Sunset Lowracer [TM] Fanatic
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
Edward Dolan wrote:
> ...Mostly they are types like Perry Butler of Alexandria....
By his own admission (since he posted his address on a.r.b.r), Mr.
Perry Butler lives in the Douglas County boondocks [1] between
Evansville, Minnesota and Lake Christina.
Please pay attention.
[1] Estimated travel time to Evansville from the Butler residence by
recumbent bicycle [2] is 10-15 minutes.
[2] I have no intention of visiting the area, by recumbent bicycle,
trike or other means of conveyance.
--
Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley
"We are discussing whether humans as prey are 'natural'. Clearly,
they are, or that mountain lion wouldn't have been trying to eat a
human." - M.V.
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Date: 21 Sep 2005 12:50:57
From: Edward Dolan
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
"Sunset Lowracer [TM] Fanatic" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:1127270121.061595.224800@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>
> Edward Dolan wrote:
>> ...Mostly they are types like Perry Butler of Alexandria....
>
> By his own admission (since he posted his address on a.r.b.r), Mr.
> Perry Butler lives in the Douglas County boondocks [1] between
> Evansville, Minnesota and Lake Christina.
>
> Please pay attention.
>
> [1] Estimated travel time to Evansville from the Butler residence by
> recumbent bicycle [2] is 10-15 minutes.
> [2] I have no intention of visiting the area, by recumbent bicycle,
> trike or other means of conveyance.
> --
> Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley
Since Perry Butler is a stickler about the exact burg where he is from, I
will forever and a day dictate that he is essentially from Alexandria,
Minnesota. This is small resort town that is nothing if not a total misery.
It is set up for the suckers and the cheapskates who do not want to go all
the way to the true north which is too freaking far and will cost them more
to stay there. There are some lakes at Alexandria which is its chief claim
to fame.
On the whole, I am very much opposed to folks living in the countryside
unless they are farming or ranching. It ruins the countryside to see a lot
of houses scattered about the landscape. Before you know it, Minnesota will
end up looking like Ohio because of types like Perry Butler.
--
Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota
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Date: 20 Sep 2005 16:58:47
From: Sunset Lowracer [TM] Fanatic
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
Jeff Grippe wrote:
> "Edward Dolan" <edolan@iw.net> wrote in message
> news:UvWdnaZRyce1wq3eRVn-hQ@prairiewave.com...
> >
> >> I have no problem with you deciding that you want to shop at the
> >> low-price provider. The only thing I have a problem with is when you
> >> consume the resources of the high-end provider and then buy from the
> >> low-price provider.
> >
> > Agreed, but I have never done the above in my life. I do my own research
> > without the aid of any provider and then I shop price.
>
> You see this is why I don't bother with your silly posting rules. If you had
> read the thread then you would know that the very thing that you say you
> don't do, someone talked about doing. I was merely agreeing that (s)he
> shouldn't do that.
>
> For reasons known only to you and your god, this sent you into a bit of a
> fit and you chose to lash out at me simply because I find service something
> that I'm willing to pay for and because I feel that others shouldn't steal
> it just because they can.
>
> So you see my dear Mr. Dolan, using your "preferred" and supposedly "proper"
> posting style did not avoid your comment which added nothing useful to what
> was being said.
>
> I don't get your drift at all. Parody or none I would prefer that you drift
> away as you said you would. If you don't intend to keep your word then at
> least say you've changed your mind and I'll stop thinking of you as a liar
> (in that context).
You have much to learn in the ways of Mr. Edward Dolan of Worthington,
Minnesota, Mr. Jeff Grippe of New York, New York.
--
Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley
"We are discussing whether humans as prey are 'natural'. Clearly,
they are, or that mountain lion wouldn't have been trying to eat a
human." - M.V.
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Date: 21 Sep 2005 05:54:21
From: Jeff Grippe
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
"Sunset Lowracer [TM] Fanatic" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:1127260727.938808.98520@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> You have much to learn in the ways of Mr. Edward Dolan of Worthington,
> Minnesota, Mr. Jeff Grippe of New York, New York.
This may be so but I fear the price of the education is beyond what I am
willing to pay. Then again, maybe not.
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Date: 20 Sep 2005 19:36:40
From: Edward Dolan
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
"Sunset Lowracer [TM] Fanatic" <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com > wrote in message
news:1127260727.938808.98520@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
>
> Jeff Grippe wrote:
>> "Edward Dolan" <edolan@iw.net> wrote in message
>> news:UvWdnaZRyce1wq3eRVn-hQ@prairiewave.com...
>> >
>> >> I have no problem with you deciding that you want to shop at the
>> >> low-price provider. The only thing I have a problem with is when you
>> >> consume the resources of the high-end provider and then buy from the
>> >> low-price provider.
>> >
>> > Agreed, but I have never done the above in my life. I do my own
>> > research
>> > without the aid of any provider and then I shop price.
>>
>> You see this is why I don't bother with your silly posting rules. If you
>> had
>> read the thread then you would know that the very thing that you say you
>> don't do, someone talked about doing. I was merely agreeing that (s)he
>> shouldn't do that.
>>
>> For reasons known only to you and your god, this sent you into a bit of a
>> fit and you chose to lash out at me simply because I find service
>> something
>> that I'm willing to pay for and because I feel that others shouldn't
>> steal
>> it just because they can.
>>
>> So you see my dear Mr. Dolan, using your "preferred" and supposedly
>> "proper"
>> posting style did not avoid your comment which added nothing useful to
>> what
>> was being said.
>>
>> I don't get your drift at all. Parody or none I would prefer that you
>> drift
>> away as you said you would. If you don't intend to keep your word then at
>> least say you've changed your mind and I'll stop thinking of you as a
>> liar
>> (in that context).
>
> You have much to learn in the ways of Mr. Edward Dolan of Worthington,
> Minnesota, Mr. Jeff Grippe of New York, New York.
> --
> Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley
But I have lived in New York and know what kind of jerks live there. Jeff
Grippe has never lived in Worthington and so he does not know what kind of
jerks live here. Mostly they are types like Perry Butler of Alexandria. But
in any event, I have the advantage of him and feel rather badly about it. I
do not like to take unfair advantage of my inferiors.
--
Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota
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Date: 20 Sep 2005 16:53:26
From: Sunset Lowracer [TM] Fanatic
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
Edward Dolan wrote:
> ...But nonetheless, buying a bike is not rocket science....
Unless the bike is question is a RANS Rocket.
--
Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley
"We are discussing whether humans as prey are 'natural'. Clearly,
they are, or that mountain lion wouldn't have been trying to eat a
human." - M.V.
|
| |
Date: 19 Sep 2005 16:59:52
From: Sunset Lowracer [TM] Fanatic
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
grk@usa.net wrote:
> The other 'bent I'm considering is the Bacchetta Aero (modified by
> Angletech "SHO" with a Rotor Crank added - 26/44/56T). I doubt that
> I'd hold anyone up with that bike, but I am a little worried about
> stability. I have never ridden a 'bent before and don't feel right
> about going to a LBS to test ride when I know I'll be getting the bike
> mail-order.
Is Bacchetta letting Angletech sell the Aero mail order? The Bacchetta
website [1] says they do not allow mail order.
[1] <http://www.bacchettabikes.com/b-faq.htm >.
--
Tom Sherman - Fox River Valley
"We are discussing whether humans as prey are 'natural'. Clearly,
they are, or that mountain lion wouldn't have been trying to eat a
human." - M.V.
|
| |
Date: 19 Sep 2005 06:18:30
From:
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
The other 'bent I'm considering is the Bacchetta Aero (modified by
Angletech "SHO" with a Rotor Crank added - 26/44/56T). I doubt that
I'd hold anyone up with that bike, but I am a little worried about
stability. I have never ridden a 'bent before and don't feel right
about going to a LBS to test ride when I know I'll be getting the bike
mail-order.
|
| | |
Date: 20 Sep 2005 09:20:28
From: Jeff Grippe
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
<grk@usa.net > wrote in message
news:1127135910.380129.176780@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> I have never ridden a 'bent before and don't feel right
> about going to a LBS to test ride when I know I'll be getting the bike
> mail-order.
I think it is good that you don't feel right about this. The LBS (if it is
any good at all) deserves the premium price and should deliver premium
service.
I went to an LBS and asked them to get me a bike that they don't normally
carry but that was available from their distributor. Even though I went in
asking for a specific bike, they were still going to honor their
"satisfaction" guarantee.
The LBS (and for that matter any other specialty retailer) invests in
inventory for you to try out, parts should you need them, mechanics who know
what they are doing, etc.
You shouldn't (ethically) consume their resources if you don't plan to give
them your business.
For the record, I am not in the bike or any retail business. I tend to value
good customer service over low price. The problem comes when you expect the
good service from the lowest price provider who doesn't have enough profit
to afford to give you that service.
Jeff
|
| | | |
Date: 20 Sep 2005 10:26:32
From: Edward Dolan
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
"Jeff Grippe" <jgrippe@hilldun.com > wrote in message
news:11j037j96jg012d@news.supernews.com...
> <grk@usa.net> wrote in message
> news:1127135910.380129.176780@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
[...]
> For the record, I am not in the bike or any retail business. I tend to
> value good customer service over low price. The problem comes when you
> expect the good service from the lowest price provider who doesn't have
> enough profit to afford to give you that service.
I value low price above all other things in life. Service isn't worth
anything these days. Anyone who pays for service is nothing but a dreamer
and a big time loser. If Wal-t has what you want, then get it there and
never look back.
Leave the high prices and "good customer service" (whatever that is) to
snobs like Jeff Grippe, who insists on thinking himself superior and better
off then the common run of men like you and I.
Why can't Jeff Grippe be humble like me and go for the low prices at
Wal-t? I myself, as Great as I am, have never even heard of any such
thing as "good customer service." I wonder what he could be blathering
about?
--
Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota
|
| | | | |
Date: 20 Sep 2005 13:57:31
From: Jeff Grippe
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
"Edward Dolan" <edolan@iw.net > wrote in message
news:5JmdncRuJZC0t63eRVn-rA@prairiewave.com...
>
> "Jeff Grippe" <jgrippe@hilldun.com> wrote in message
> news:11j037j96jg012d@news.supernews.com...
>> <grk@usa.net> wrote in message
>> news:1127135910.380129.176780@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> [...]
>> For the record, I am not in the bike or any retail business. I tend to
>> value good customer service over low price. The problem comes when you
>> expect the good service from the lowest price provider who doesn't have
>> enough profit to afford to give you that service.
>
> I value low price above all other things in life. Service isn't worth
> anything these days. Anyone who pays for service is nothing but a dreamer
> and a big time loser. If Wal-t has what you want, then get it there and
> never look back.
>
> Leave the high prices and "good customer service" (whatever that is) to
> snobs like Jeff Grippe, who insists on thinking himself superior and
> better off then the common run of men like you and I.
>
> Why can't Jeff Grippe be humble like me and go for the low prices at
> Wal-t? I myself, as Great as I am, have never even heard of any such
> thing as "good customer service." I wonder what he could be blathering
> about?
>
I have no problem with you deciding that you want to shop at the low-price
provider. The only thing I have a problem with is when you consume the
resources of the high-end provider and then buy from the low-price provider.
If you place no value on customer service then by all means don't buy it (by
shopping at a store that provides it). On the same hand, don't steal it
either. If you go to a bike shop and test ride several bikes in order to
make your choice and then you buy it on-line, you have stolen from the bike
shop. The bike shop can only be there to provide you with bikes to try out
if people buy them from the bike shop.
Jeff
PS I like "humble as I am" and "Great like me" in the same paragraph.
|
| | | | | |
Date: 20 Sep 2005 14:12:39
From: Edward Dolan
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
"Jeff Grippe" <jgrippe@hilldun.com > wrote in message
news:11j0jfg4dcasv6a@news.supernews.com...
>
> "Edward Dolan" <edolan@iw.net> wrote in message
> news:5JmdncRuJZC0t63eRVn-rA@prairiewave.com...
>>
>> "Jeff Grippe" <jgrippe@hilldun.com> wrote in message
>> news:11j037j96jg012d@news.supernews.com...
>>> <grk@usa.net> wrote in message
>>> news:1127135910.380129.176780@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
>> [...]
>>> For the record, I am not in the bike or any retail business. I tend to
>>> value good customer service over low price. The problem comes when you
>>> expect the good service from the lowest price provider who doesn't have
>>> enough profit to afford to give you that service.
>>
>> I value low price above all other things in life. Service isn't worth
>> anything these days. Anyone who pays for service is nothing but a dreamer
>> and a big time loser. If Wal-t has what you want, then get it there
>> and never look back.
>>
>> Leave the high prices and "good customer service" (whatever that is) to
>> snobs like Jeff Grippe, who insists on thinking himself superior and
>> better off then the common run of men like you and I.
>>
>> Why can't Jeff Grippe be humble like me and go for the low prices at
>> Wal-t? I myself, as Great as I am, have never even heard of any such
>> thing as "good customer service." I wonder what he could be blathering
>> about?
>>
>
> I have no problem with you deciding that you want to shop at the low-price
> provider. The only thing I have a problem with is when you consume the
> resources of the high-end provider and then buy from the low-price
> provider.
Agreed, but I have never done the above in my life. I do my own research
without the aid of any provider and then I shop price. What could be
simpler? If I use a shop, then I buy from the shop. But I NEVER expect any
service regardless.
> If you place no value on customer service then by all means don't buy it
> (by shopping at a store that provides it). On the same hand, don't steal
> it either. If you go to a bike shop and test ride several bikes in order
> to make your choice and then you buy it on-line, you have stolen from the
> bike shop. The bike shop can only be there to provide you with bikes to
> try out if people buy them from the bike shop.
See my statement directly above. However, I do agree with what Jeff says.
By the way, I have never in my life test ridden a bike before buying it (and
I have got a house full of bikes). What the hell is there to test. I can see
immediately what all the pros and cons of a bike are simply by looking at it
in a catalog and reading the specifications.
Recumbent Cyclist News (RCN) is the best source of course for learning
something about recumbent bikes. Robert Bryant (the editor, publisher and
chief writer of RCN) is a national treasure and I can never say enough good
things about him. But nonetheless, buying a bike is not rocket science.
> Jeff
>
> PS I like "humble as I am" and "Great like me" in the same paragraph.
Glad to see that you are FINALLY starting to get my drift! Now look up
"parody" in a dictionary. That is what I am a master of and I will brook no
false prophets before me.
--
Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota
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Date: 20 Sep 2005 16:23:56
From: Jeff Grippe
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
"Edward Dolan" <edolan@iw.net > wrote in message
news:UvWdnaZRyce1wq3eRVn-hQ@prairiewave.com...
>
>> I have no problem with you deciding that you want to shop at the
>> low-price provider. The only thing I have a problem with is when you
>> consume the resources of the high-end provider and then buy from the
>> low-price provider.
>
> Agreed, but I have never done the above in my life. I do my own research
> without the aid of any provider and then I shop price.
You see this is why I don't bother with your silly posting rules. If you had
read the thread then you would know that the very thing that you say you
don't do, someone talked about doing. I was merely agreeing that (s)he
shouldn't do that.
For reasons known only to you and your god, this sent you into a bit of a
fit and you chose to lash out at me simply because I find service something
that I'm willing to pay for and because I feel that others shouldn't steal
it just because they can.
So you see my dear Mr. Dolan, using your "preferred" and supposedly "proper"
posting style did not avoid your comment which added nothing useful to what
was being said.
I don't get your drift at all. Parody or none I would prefer that you drift
away as you said you would. If you don't intend to keep your word then at
least say you've changed your mind and I'll stop thinking of you as a liar
(in that context).
|
| | | | | | | |
Date: 20 Sep 2005 16:56:29
From: Edward Dolan
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
"Jeff Grippe" <jgrippe@hilldun.com > wrote in message
news:11j0s10cbjksd71@news.supernews.com...
> "Edward Dolan" <edolan@iw.net> wrote in message
> news:UvWdnaZRyce1wq3eRVn-hQ@prairiewave.com...
>>
>>> I have no problem with you deciding that you want to shop at the
>>> low-price provider. The only thing I have a problem with is when you
>>> consume the resources of the high-end provider and then buy from the
>>> low-price provider.
>>
>> Agreed, but I have never done the above in my life. I do my own research
>> without the aid of any provider and then I shop price.
>
> You see this is why I don't bother with your silly posting rules. If you
> had read the thread then you would know that the very thing that you say
> you don't do, someone talked about doing. I was merely agreeing that (s)he
> shouldn't do that.
If you posted the RIGHT way instead of the WRONG way maybe some of these
little contretemps could be avoided. But you are doomed to forever be
mangled and misconstrued because you post like the idiot that you are.
> For reasons known only to you and your god, this sent you into a bit of a
> fit and you chose to lash out at me simply because I find service
> something that I'm willing to pay for and because I feel that others
> shouldn't steal it just because they can.
You said you like to pay for service; I said that service is for the birds.
What part of that did you not understand.
> So you see my dear Mr. Dolan, using your "preferred" and supposedly
> "proper" posting style did not avoid your comment which added nothing
> useful to what was being said.
>
> I don't get your drift at all. Parody or none I would prefer that you
> drift away as you said you would.
Why the hell didn't you quote the relevant passage by me to which you are
referring with the "drift' and the "parody" comment, you confounded
numskull! Did anyone ever tell you that you are an idiot? Well, I am
telling you now. Why the dickens don't you confine yourself to email with
other morons on your low level and not bother us intelligent types here on
Usenet.
Post RIGHT or begone!
If you don't intend to keep your word then at
> least say you've changed your mind and I'll stop thinking of you as a liar
> (in that context).
Just stop posting such incredibly stupid messages to this newsgroup. I feel
I have to protect the rest of the group from a dunderhead like you. Who
knows, they might actually listen to you if I weren't here to tell them
otherwise.
--
Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota
|
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Date: 20 Sep 2005 20:08:01
From: Jeff Grippe
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
My dear Edward, as one who pushes buttons with abandon can it really come as
a surprise to you that I enjoy pushing yours back?
Snot faced baby killing liberal NY Jew signing off
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Date: 20 Sep 2005 19:30:38
From: Edward Dolan
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
"Jeff Grippe" <jeff@door7.com > wrote in message
news:11j1939ckm77de0@news.supernews.com...
> My dear Edward, as one who pushes buttons with abandon can it really come
> as a surprise to you that I enjoy pushing yours back?
>
> Snot faced baby killing liberal NY Jew signing off
It is no easy trick to render someone like Jeff Grippe speechless. Brainless
he has always been, but now he is speechless. Let this be a lesson to you
all not to tangle with the Great Ed Dolan.
--
Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota
|
| | |
Date: 19 Sep 2005 14:22:06
From: Peter Clinch
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
grk@usa.net wrote:
> The other 'bent I'm considering is the Bacchetta Aero (modified by
> Angletech "SHO" with a Rotor Crank added - 26/44/56T). I doubt that
> I'd hold anyone up with that bike, but I am a little worried about
> stability. I have never ridden a 'bent before and don't feel right
> about going to a LBS to test ride when I know I'll be getting the bike
> mail-order.
Explain that to the owner and see if s/he's happy with it, and don't
forget that there's plenty of business you can put their way without
buying the bike itself. Stock up on tyres/tubes, lubes etc.
Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net p.j.clinch@dundee.ac.uk http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
|
| | | |
Date: 19 Sep 2005 12:25:27
From: Jon Meinecke
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
"Peter Clinch" <p.j.clinch@dundee.ac.uk > wrote
> grk@usa.net wrote:
> > don't feel right about going to a LBS to test ride when
> > I know I'll be getting the bike mail-order.
>
> Explain that to the owner and see if s/he's happy with it, and don't
> forget that there's plenty of business you can put their way without
> buying the bike itself. Stock up on tyres/tubes, lubes etc.
The OP [grk] could tell them he is considering purchasing a used
bike and offer to pay the LBS for the test ride and consultation.
Arrange to visit when they're not busy, perhaps.
The other thing to consider when buying a bike "seat unridden"
is how difficult it may be to sell it if it doesn't work out. Taking
a small loss to unload a bike you buy on "spec" might be an
acceptable cost. Obviously, the more popular the bike and
the better the deal, the easier it will be to dispose of it without
taking a bath.
I've tried three times, but I've yet to buy a recumbent bike
locally...
Jon Meinecke
|
| | | | |
Date: 20 Sep 2005 07:41:18
From: my news
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
My lbs managed to match an internet price. Never hurts to go in with the
price plus shipping and see what you get. I managed to get it with assemble
and tax out the door for what I was going to order it for.
|
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Date: 19 Sep 2005 06:24:19
From: Jeff Grippe
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
My move was from 'bent bike to trike which is not the same as the question
that you asked.
My average speed seems to have taken a 2 MPH dip although I must say that I
was never an A rider. My dip has been from 10-11 down to 8-9. The quality of
the trike also makes a big difference. The trike I use for commuting
(Tricruiser) is about 1-2 mph slower than the trike I use for touring
(Greenspeed GT3). I know this because the Tricruiser has been in the shop
and I've been commuting with the Greenspeed. The difference in speed is very
noticable.
When my wife and I did some rail trails earlier this summer (basically flat)
I was pedaling almost constantly and she got to coast frequently. She was on
a diamond frame and I was on a trike. It should also be added, however, that
she weighs 110 and I weigh 250.
Jeff
<grk@usa.net > wrote in message
news:1127073579.975213.4900@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>I am (strongly) considering getting an ICE Micro trike for Christmas.
>
> On club rides on my Trek diamond frame, I usually do about 12-14 MPH in
> the pack without any stress/strain for 30-40 miles on relatively flat
> terrain. (Finished a 38 mile ride today with the early group).
>
> Have people who used both DFs and trikes experienced big differences in
> speed between the two at the same physical effort? In other words, am I
> going to hold back the pack with a trike at 12-14 MPH?
>
> I know this is a loaded question and that all riders are different, but
> what experiences have people had?
>
> Thanks, Ralph
>
|
| |
Date: 19 Sep 2005 09:55:47
From: Peter Clinch
Subject: Re: Q: Keeping up with the Jones
|
grk@usa.net wrote:
> Have people who used both DFs and trikes experienced big differences in
> speed between the two at the same physical effort? In other words, am I
> going to hold back the pack with a trike at 12-14 MPH?
The problem isn't so much the trike will be slower generally (though it
may well be), but, like a tandem, it has different performance
characteristics on different terrains to a typical upwrong. Hill climbs
you'll very probably be slower, going down the other side or into a
stiff headwind you'll be ahead of everyone else, and so on.
Even if the average speed is exactly the same it may turn out to be
antisocial. I've spoken to folk that have abandoned Tricen for group
rides for this reason.
Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net p.j.clinch@dundee.ac.uk http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
|
| |
Date: 18 Sep 2005 19:44:39
From: Mark Leuck
Subject: Re: Keeping up with the Jones
|
<grk@usa.net > wrote in message
news:1127073579.975213.4900@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> I am (strongly) considering getting an ICE Micro trike for Christmas.
>
> On club rides on my Trek diamond frame, I usually do about 12-14 MPH in
> the pack without any stress/strain for 30-40 miles on relatively flat
> terrain. (Finished a 38 mile ride today with the early group).
>
> Have people who used both DFs and trikes experienced big differences in
> speed between the two at the same physical effort? In other words, am I
> going to hold back the pack with a trike at 12-14 MPH?
>
> I know this is a loaded question and that all riders are different, but
> what experiences have people had?
>
> Thanks, Ralph
I'd say the trike will be slower
|
| |
Date: 18 Sep 2005 15:32:08
From: LoGo USA
Subject: Re: Q: Keeping up with the Jones
|
Hey -
Ralph asked:
>Have people who used both DFs and trikes experienced big
>differences in speed between the two at the same physical
>effort? In other words, am I going to hold back the pack
>with a trike at 12-14 MPH?
We have a very active local recumbent cycling group, with
both trikes and bikes, with riders that span about the
entire speed range you'd expect for folks who aren't
intimidated by a 25 to 40 mile ride. I think the general
consensus of riders in our group who've ridden both 'fast'
bikes and typical sports touring tadpoles is that you're
likely to see a difference of about one to two miles per
hour at those speeds. If you're working hard to keep up
now, a trike might make you feel a bit more pressure. If
you're fairly comfortably in the middle of the pack on an
ordinary road bike, you're very likely to LOVE the feel
and the fun of the trike.
Regards,
Wayne
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