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Main
Date: 15 Jul 2005 10:39:01
From: Jim & Meg
Subject: foot pain
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Foot pain. I wear the cycling sandals using the spd cleats. The pain I
have is on the outer most part of my foot ( across from the ball of my
foot). It almost seems like the pedal is too wide or I tilt my feet. I've
been thinking that it might help if I install pedals that aren't as wide. I
am riding a Cannondale Bent II, however I had the same pain when riding my
Cannondale Super V 500. I start feeling the pain after about 4 miles. I
don't know if this matters or not but I'm 62 and weigh 315 pounds. I bike
about 1500 miles a year. Any thoughts.
Thanks,
Jim
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Date: 17 Jul 2005 12:48:01
From: Leif
Subject: Re: foot pain
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"This is a somewhat common issue. Some people get "hot foot". "
"Hot toes" is more like what I experienced during my last tour. I
noticed that toward the end of each day, after maybe 6 hours of riding,
the three middle toes of both feet felt like someone was holding a blow
torch to them ----- OUCH!!!
The pain was so severe at times I had t click out off my SPD's and
shake my feet. Interestingly, the toes would eventually go numb which
lasted for several weeks after I'd completed the tour.
-Leif
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Date: 18 Jul 2005 07:12:06
From: Buck
Subject: Re: foot pain
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On 07/17/2005 20:48:01 "Leif" <LeifEric@gmail.com > wrote:
> "This is a somewhat common issue. Some people get "hot foot". "
> "Hot toes" is more like what I experienced during my last tour. I noticed
> that toward the end of each day, after maybe 6 hours of riding, the three
> middle toes of both feet felt like someone was holding a blow torch to
> them ----- OUCH!!!
> The pain was so severe at times I had t click out off my SPD's and shake
> my feet. Interestingly, the toes would eventually go numb which lasted
> for several weeks after I'd completed the tour.
> -Leif
It is a circulation issue, often with high bb's, there are two possible
cures, move your cleats further towards the toes of your shoes, or, try
different shoes.
--
Buck
I would rather be out on my Catrike
http://www.catrike.co.uk
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Date: 18 Jul 2005 04:11:04
From: Edward Dolan
Subject: Re: foot pain
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"Buck" <ian@ATtrikesandstuffDOT.coDOT.uk > wrote in message
news:718812.JYSCXPTD@news.blueyonder.co.uk...
>
>
> On 07/17/2005 20:48:01 "Leif" <LeifEric@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> "This is a somewhat common issue. Some people get "hot foot". "
>
>> "Hot toes" is more like what I experienced during my last tour. I
>> noticed
>> that toward the end of each day, after maybe 6 hours of riding, the three
>> middle toes of both feet felt like someone was holding a blow torch to
>> them ----- OUCH!!!
>
>> The pain was so severe at times I had t click out off my SPD's and shake
>> my feet. Interestingly, the toes would eventually go numb which lasted
>> for several weeks after I'd completed the tour.
>
>> -Leif
>
> It is a circulation issue, often with high bb's, there are two possible
> cures, move your cleats further towards the toes of your shoes, or, try
> different shoes.
The main cure is to get a bike with a lower BB. None of this is rocket
science except to types like Ian of the UK.
Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
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Date: 18 Jul 2005 06:26:03
From: Jeff Grippe
Subject: Re: foot pain
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"Edward Dolan" <edolan@iw.net > wrote in message
news:TJWdnaNACLOu70bfRVn-rw@prairiewave.com...
>
> The main cure is to get a bike with a lower BB. None of this is rocket
> science except to types like Ian of the UK.
Not the answer for me I'm afraid. For the moment I've given up on pedal
systems and I've sticking with toeclips. Frankly at my age and with my
riding style I don't really see the need for anything better.
Jeff
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Date: 18 Jul 2005 13:30:47
From: Peter Clinch
Subject: Re: foot pain
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Jeff Grippe wrote:
> Not the answer for me I'm afraid. For the moment I've given up on pedal
> systems and I've sticking with toeclips. Frankly at my age and with my
> riding style I don't really see the need for anything better.
Don't really see how age and riding style rule out something that
generally works better and is easier to use... I moved over to
SpuD-u-likes on my old upright tourer years ago because they helped me
pedal more efficiently and were easier to get in and out of than my
clips. On the recumbent the difference is even greater.
Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net p.j.clinch@dundee.ac.uk http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
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Date: 18 Jul 2005 09:37:57
From: Jeff Grippe
Subject: Re: foot pain
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"Peter Clinch" <p.j.clinch@dundee.ac.uk > wrote in message
news:3k1ln2Fs1gs2U1@individual.net...
>
> Don't really see how age and riding style rule out something that
> generally works better and is easier to use...
All I'm saying is that the way I ride now doesn't require the increased
efficiency. I've always ridden for the exercise. Decreased efficiency
essentially means more work for me which is what I'm out there riding for
anyway.
On my recent rail-trail trip my wife and I both noticed that I was pedaling
all the time while she got to coast quite often. The bottom line here is
that I didn't mind the fact that I was working harder. It was why I was out
there in the first place.
So for me toe clips are good enough and I know that I won't be in pain at
the end of the ride. I'm not saying that they are better or that I couldn't
learn to ride with a pedal system. It's just that efficiency isn't important
to me. Getting more exercise is. I'm not going to go out of my way to
increase my workload but I don't give a second thought to taking lots of
stuff, buying a heavier bike if it is more comfortable, or even pulling a
trailer.
Jeff
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Date: 18 Jul 2005 16:56:14
From: Edward Dolan
Subject: Re: foot pain
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"Jeff Grippe" <jgrippe@hilldun.com > wrote in message
news:11dnc77lmh9e8e@news.supernews.com...
>
> "Peter Clinch" <p.j.clinch@dundee.ac.uk> wrote in message
> news:3k1ln2Fs1gs2U1@individual.net...
>>
>> Don't really see how age and riding style rule out something that
>> generally works better and is easier to use...
>
> All I'm saying is that the way I ride now doesn't require the increased
> efficiency. I've always ridden for the exercise. Decreased efficiency
> essentially means more work for me which is what I'm out there riding for
> anyway.
>
> On my recent rail-trail trip my wife and I both noticed that I was
> pedaling all the time while she got to coast quite often. The bottom line
> here is that I didn't mind the fact that I was working harder. It was why
> I was out there in the first place.
I agree with Jeff. I too ride more for the exercise than anything else.
Therefore, I do not require the ultimate efficiency nor am I ever too
concerned about the weight of the bike either. It is only the speed freaks
who need all the latest and greatest gear.
> So for me toe clips are good enough and I know that I won't be in pain at
> the end of the ride. I'm not saying that they are better or that I
> couldn't learn to ride with a pedal system. It's just that efficiency
> isn't important to me. Getting more exercise is. I'm not going to go out
> of my way to increase my workload but I don't give a second thought to
> taking lots of stuff, buying a heavier bike if it is more comfortable, or
> even pulling a trailer.
I rode with toe clips for over 20 years and never had a problem with them.
The main thing is to make sure they are large enough to accommodate the
length of your foot. If they are too short, you will have lots of knee pain.
However, I also agree with Peter that clipless does work better for
recumbents because of the higher BBs. I do not use toe clips anymore since I
now ride recumbents exclusively. I will admit I have never had a problem
with clipless either. The only foot problems I have ever had were numb feet
from a too high BB. The BB cannot be higher than the seat (hip joint) or I
will get numb feet.
Ed Dolan - Minnesota
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Date: 18 Jul 2005 15:01:02
From: Peter Clinch
Subject: Re: foot pain
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Jeff Grippe wrote:
> All I'm saying is that the way I ride now doesn't require the increased
> efficiency. I've always ridden for the exercise. Decreased efficiency
> essentially means more work for me which is what I'm out there riding for
> anyway.
So let your tyres down a bit...
Seriously, why not just go a bit further and/or faster for the same
effort?
> So for me toe clips are good enough and I know that I won't be in pain at
> the end of the ride. I'm not saying that they are better or that I couldn't
> learn to ride with a pedal system. It's just that efficiency isn't important
> to me.
However, having your feet held where you want them with no effort is a
definite benefit on a 'bent, efficiency notwithsatnding, and IME it
improves the comfort as well.
Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net p.j.clinch@dundee.ac.uk http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
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Date: 18 Jul 2005 11:43:47
From: Jeff Grippe
Subject: Re: foot pain
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"Peter Clinch" <p.j.clinch@dundee.ac.uk > wrote in message
news:3k1r09FrlmsuU1@individual.net...
> However, having your feet held where you want them with no effort is a
> definite benefit on a 'bent, efficiency notwithsatnding, and IME it
> improves the comfort as well.
>
If I could solve the pain problem I would do it. There are two areas that
cause me difficulty.
1. Foot pain caused by the small surface area that the pedal applies
pressure to.
2. Knee pain related to getting out of the system.
I have tried a few systems and very very stiff shoes which didn't seem to
help. Even if the stiff shoes did help, I'm not really crazy about them. The
bottom line for me seems to be too many negatives and not enough positives
to outweigh them. I didn't mean to say that I want to go out of my way to
make my rides harder. I just don't mind that they are a little harder.
Jeff
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Date: 15 Jul 2005 17:05:58
From: Mark Leuck
Subject: Re: foot pain
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Sounds like the sandals aren't giving your foot enough support
"Jim & Meg" <jtdickie@cox.net > wrote in message
news:hUPBe.56116$iU.34626@lakeread05...
> Foot pain. I wear the cycling sandals using the spd cleats. The pain I
> have is on the outer most part of my foot ( across from the ball of my
> foot). It almost seems like the pedal is too wide or I tilt my feet.
I've
> been thinking that it might help if I install pedals that aren't as wide.
I
> am riding a Cannondale Bent II, however I had the same pain when riding my
> Cannondale Super V 500. I start feeling the pain after about 4 miles. I
> don't know if this matters or not but I'm 62 and weigh 315 pounds. I bike
> about 1500 miles a year. Any thoughts.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim
>
>
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Date: 15 Jul 2005 16:59:47
From: Jim & Meg
Subject: Re: foot pain
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I'm giving these a try, I'll keep you posted. Sheldon Brown put me on to
these. Also, thanks to all for you input.
"There is a product with the goofy name "Big Meat" which consists of
> wedge-shaped shims that fit between the cleat and the shoe to adjust the
> tilt of the cleat sideways. These _might_ be of some benefit to you."
Jim
"Jim & Meg" <jtdickie@cox.net > wrote in message
news:hUPBe.56116$iU.34626@lakeread05...
> Foot pain. I wear the cycling sandals using the spd cleats. The pain I
> have is on the outer most part of my foot ( across from the ball of my
> foot). It almost seems like the pedal is too wide or I tilt my feet.
> I've been thinking that it might help if I install pedals that aren't as
> wide. I am riding a Cannondale Bent II, however I had the same pain when
> riding my Cannondale Super V 500. I start feeling the pain after about 4
> miles. I don't know if this matters or not but I'm 62 and weigh 315
> pounds. I bike about 1500 miles a year. Any thoughts.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim
>
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Date: 15 Jul 2005 15:11:57
From: Jeff Grippe
Subject: Re: foot pain
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As long as we are on this topic I'd like to throw in my story and get some
opinions.
I have tried and given up on pedal systems several times for the following
reasons:
1. They tend to concentrate too much into too little area on my foot. Read
that as "It hurts".
2. I always have trouble getting out of them. Now that I ride a trike, at
least I don't fall over getting out of them but I usually have to twist my
foot in a way that is painful to my damaged knees.
3. I haven't found them to be much better than toe clips which I continue to
use.
But I know some of you swear by pedal systems so I'd love to hear what you
have to say in answer to my concerns.
Thanks,
Jeff
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Date: 15 Jul 2005 15:17:09
From: Jon Meinecke
Subject: Re: foot pain
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"Jeff Grippe" <jgrippe@hilldun.com > wrote
>
> I have tried and given up on pedal systems several
> times for the following reasons:
>
> 1. They tend to concentrate too much into too little area on my foot. Read
> that as "It hurts".
This is a somewhat common issue. Some people get "hot foot".
Commonly offered solutions:
- stiffer shoes
- different footbed insert
- moving cleat
- clipless pedals with larger surface
- combo clipless/platform pedals
> 2. I always have trouble getting out of them. Now that I
> ride a trike, at least I don't fall over getting out of them
> but I usually have to twist my foot in a way that is painful
> to my damaged knees.
I use SPD clipless pedals and multidirection release
cleats. I also do not tighten the release spring too tight.
I've not done the Artie Johnson Laugh-In routine, but
I've had a couple of panic stops and wind-shift balance
changes with one-foot clipped in, one-foot down. In
these cases, I didn't think about twisting, but just
yanked my foot out of the clip. Might not be so
easy to get out of if I tightened the release spring.
People with knee issues often have strong preferences
for certain clipless pedals type and often mention float
as a big issue.
> 3. I haven't found them to be much better than toe clips
> which I continue to use.
I've not used toe clips recently. I used PowerGrips for
a number of years on my BikeE. I don't know if clipless
is that much more efficient, I just know it now feels funny
to ride without being clipped in.
I have Shimano 324 SPD/platform pedals on the BikeE,
single-sided SPD pedals (? model) on the Tour Easy,
and dual-sided 52x SPD pedals on the Volae. I've never
spent more the $40 for clipless pedals, buying them on
closeout or with discount coupon.
I've been tempted by sales to try the Crank Bros Egg
Beaters, but figure with three bikes to outfit, I don't really
want to bother. In my case, the SPDs work "good enough."
Jon Meinecke
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Date: 15 Jul 2005 11:20:00
From: Jon Meinecke
Subject: Re: foot pain
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"Jim & Meg" <jtdickie@cox.net > wrote
>
> Foot pain. I wear the cycling sandals using the spd cleats.
> The pain I have is on the outer most part of my foot
> ( across from the ball of my foot). It almost seems like
> the pedal is too wide or I tilt my feet.
In order of ease of trying different things...
1. Have you tried adjusting the position of the cleats
on the sandals? Forward or back, or angle... A small
change might be enough to reduce the stress on your feet.
2. The pain might also might be related to the distance
between pedals (q-factor?). If this distance is too
small, it can causes knee problem for some people,
but I can imagine that it might also result in foot pain.
You mention tilting your feet.
There are pedal extenders that go between the crank
and pedals that might help. One brand is called
Knee Savers.
http://www.bikescor.com/product/knee.htm
3. Different people have different comfort and compatibility
issues with different clipless pedals. Some people need
or want a pedal with lots of "float". There's a lot of
information and opinions on different types of pedals in
the newsgroups and other forums. Google frogs,
speedplay, egg beaters, etc.. Check with your LBS,
they might let you try out different types of pedals.
4. Finally, some people have reported they got foot relief
after getting orthopedic footbed inserts... Consulting a
podiatrist and/or sports specialist physician may be prudent.
Jon Meinecke
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