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Main
Date: 22 Jun 2007 23:28:24
From: coyote
Subject: Changda/xacd frame experience
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I see quite some opinions on these frames on various forums, but very
little real user experience.
Could I ask people who have such a frame to post their experiences with
them?
Thanks!
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Date: 27 Jun 2007 18:38:28
From: Johnny Sunset
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
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On Jun 27, 7:37 am, coyote? wrote:
>....
> Always amazed at how a bike related question turns into a aussie/us
> labour laws discussion.... Who gives a f*ck?
The fun is in participating in the discussion.
--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
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Date: 26 Jun 2007 19:31:26
From: Johnny Sunset
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
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On Jun 26, 1:24 pm, A Muzi wrote:
> >>>>>> On Jun 22, 8:44 pm, Friday wrote:
> >>>>>>> ...People say all sorts of things to try and scare you off chinese products, I don't know
> >>>>>>> why....
> >>>>> Johnny Sunset wrote:
> >>>>>> It may have nothing to do with the inherent quality of the product,
> >>>>>> and everything to do with the conditions under which it is made.
> >>>> Friday <nowh...@sometime.net.au> wrote:
> >>>>> Well the Australian Howard government has brought in radical changes
> >>>>> which aren't too dissimilar to labor conditions in third world countries
> >>>>> so that doesn't bother me at all.
> >>> Donga <idomybestworkonab...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>> As a matter of fact, the Howard Govt is trying to reduce worker
> >>>> conditions to those in the US!
> RonSonic wrote:
> >>> Unemployment rate of 4.5%?
> > Friday <nowh...@sometime.net.au> wrote:
> >> I'm sure that slaves under the Egyptian pharaohs had full employment too.
> RonSonic wrote:
> > We get to pick our jobs. Or whether or not we want one.
> > You can talk of the terror that is wage slavery and it'd all be basically
> > bullshit. Nobody has ever had more freedom to choose his work in whatever
> > portion he pleases than the modern American. Those who find they have limited
> > choices are only bordered by other choices they have made.
>
> Yes, the inherent beauty of "Equality of Opportunity" is poorly
> understood now, I think. The alternate (removal of risk) seems always
> to end with an enforced 'equality' based on 'let's cut the heads off the
> tall ones'.
The current US policy has been socialism for corporations and social
Darwinism for labor. The US government will bail out corporations with
tax money to protect rich investors, but labor and individuals are on
their own. The logic of protecting jobs no longer applies, as this
requirement for corporate welfare has been dropped in most cases.
No bid government contracts for the well connected, anyone?
Hey, but I am all for complete free-markets. Let property owners
provide their own police and fire protection. Manufactures can provide
their own roads to ship goods. Airlines can pay the full costs of
airports and air traffic control. No more foreign military bases to
protect corporate interests in hydrocarbon and mineral extraction.
Since the free-market can do everything better than government in
every case, why not eliminate all local and state governments, and
replace the federal government with a council where the number of
votes allocated are determined by financial contribution. We would
have paradise in short order!
--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
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Date: 27 Jun 2007 14:37:19
From: coyote
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
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Johnny Sunset wrote:
> On Jun 26, 1:24 pm, A Muzi wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Jun 22, 8:44 pm, Friday wrote:
>>>>>>>>> ...People say all sorts of things to try and scare you off chinese products, I don't know
>>>>>>>>> why....
>>>>>>> Johnny Sunset wrote:
>>>>>>>> It may have nothing to do with the inherent quality of the product,
>>>>>>>> and everything to do with the conditions under which it is made.
>>>>>> Friday <nowh...@sometime.net.au> wrote:
>>>>>>> Well the Australian Howard government has brought in radical changes
>>>>>>> which aren't too dissimilar to labor conditions in third world countries
>>>>>>> so that doesn't bother me at all.
>>>>> Donga <idomybestworkonab...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> As a matter of fact, the Howard Govt is trying to reduce worker
>>>>>> conditions to those in the US!
>> RonSonic wrote:
>>>>> Unemployment rate of 4.5%?
>>> Friday <nowh...@sometime.net.au> wrote:
>>>> I'm sure that slaves under the Egyptian pharaohs had full employment too.
>> RonSonic wrote:
>>> We get to pick our jobs. Or whether or not we want one.
>>> You can talk of the terror that is wage slavery and it'd all be basically
>>> bullshit. Nobody has ever had more freedom to choose his work in whatever
>>> portion he pleases than the modern American. Those who find they have limited
>>> choices are only bordered by other choices they have made.
>> Yes, the inherent beauty of "Equality of Opportunity" is poorly
>> understood now, I think. The alternate (removal of risk) seems always
>> to end with an enforced 'equality' based on 'let's cut the heads off the
>> tall ones'.
>
> The current US policy has been socialism for corporations and social
> Darwinism for labor. The US government will bail out corporations with
> tax money to protect rich investors, but labor and individuals are on
> their own. The logic of protecting jobs no longer applies, as this
> requirement for corporate welfare has been dropped in most cases.
>
> No bid government contracts for the well connected, anyone?
>
> Hey, but I am all for complete free-markets. Let property owners
> provide their own police and fire protection. Manufactures can provide
> their own roads to ship goods. Airlines can pay the full costs of
> airports and air traffic control. No more foreign military bases to
> protect corporate interests in hydrocarbon and mineral extraction.
> Since the free-market can do everything better than government in
> every case, why not eliminate all local and state governments, and
> replace the federal government with a council where the number of
> votes allocated are determined by financial contribution. We would
> have paradise in short order!
>
> --
> Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
> The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
>
Always amazed at how a bike related question turns into a aussie/us
labour laws discussion.... Who gives a f*ck?
Thanks for the reactions on the original question
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Date: 26 Jun 2007 19:21:18
From: Johnny Sunset
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
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On Jun 26, 11:53 am, "RonSonic" who? wrote:
> On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 23:05:05 +0800, Friday who? wrote:
> >RonSonic who? wrote:
> >> On Sat, 23 Jun 2007 03:28:11 -0700, Donga who? wrote:
>
> >>> On Jun 23, 3:47 pm, Friday who? wrote:
> >>>> Johnny Sunset wrote:
> >>>>> On Jun 22, 8:44 pm, Friday who? wrote:
> >>>>>> ...People say all sorts of things to try and scare you off chinese products, I don't know
> >>>>>> why....
> >>>>> It may have nothing to do with the inherent quality of the product,
> >>>>> and everything to do with the conditions under which it is made.
> >>>> Well the Australian Howard government has brought in radical changes
> >>>> which aren't too dissimilar to labor conditions in third world countries
> >>>> so that doesn't bother me at all.
>
> >>>> Friday
> >>> As a matter of fact, the Howard Govt is trying to reduce worker
> >>> conditions to those in the US!
>
> >> Unemployment rate of 4.5%?
>
> >> Ron
>
> >I'm sure that slaves under the Egyptian pharaohs had full employment too.
>
> We get to pick our jobs. Or whether or not we want one.
>
> You can talk of the terror that is wage slavery and it'd all be basically
> bullshit. Nobody has ever had more freedom to choose his work in whatever
> portion he pleases than the modern American. Those who find they have limited
> choices are only bordered by other choices they have made.
The choices of jobs are limited by what capital offers. Capital is
currently driving down wages and creating well-paying job scarcity in
the US by outsourcing.
People that don't like their job and change jobs more than a few times
in their field are viewed as undesirable, and will have trouble
getting hired in the future for that reason.
Those who can not find a decent paying job in the US are screwed,
unless they are independently wealthy.
Those whose health prevents them from being able to work 10+ hours a
day are really screwed, unless they are married to someone who can get
health care coverage for them, since even partial benefits for part-
time work are extremely rare.
And of course, the best jobs are typically awarded on the basis of
nepotism and favoritism, not effort and merit.
--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
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Date: 23 Jun 2007 03:28:11
From: Donga
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
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On Jun 23, 3:47 pm, Friday <nowh...@sometime.net.au > wrote:
> Johnny Sunset wrote:
> > On Jun 22, 8:44 pm, Friday wrote:
> >> ...People say all sorts of things to try and scare you off chinese products, I don't know
> >> why....
>
> > It may have nothing to do with the inherent quality of the product,
> > and everything to do with the conditions under which it is made.
>
> > --
> > Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
> > The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
>
> Well the Australian Howard government has brought in radical changes
> which aren't too dissimilar to labor conditions in third world countries
> so that doesn't bother me at all.
>
> Friday
As a matter of fact, the Howard Govt is trying to reduce worker
conditions to those in the US!
Donga
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Date: 25 Jun 2007 10:34:58
From: RonSonic
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
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On Sat, 23 Jun 2007 03:28:11 -0700, Donga <idomybestworkonabike@hotmail.com >
wrote:
>On Jun 23, 3:47 pm, Friday <nowh...@sometime.net.au> wrote:
>> Johnny Sunset wrote:
>> > On Jun 22, 8:44 pm, Friday wrote:
>> >> ...People say all sorts of things to try and scare you off chinese products, I don't know
>> >> why....
>>
>> > It may have nothing to do with the inherent quality of the product,
>> > and everything to do with the conditions under which it is made.
>>
>> > --
>> > Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
>> > The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
>>
>> Well the Australian Howard government has brought in radical changes
>> which aren't too dissimilar to labor conditions in third world countries
>> so that doesn't bother me at all.
>>
>> Friday
>
>As a matter of fact, the Howard Govt is trying to reduce worker
>conditions to those in the US!
Unemployment rate of 4.5%?
Ron
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Date: 25 Jun 2007 23:05:05
From: Friday
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
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RonSonic wrote:
> On Sat, 23 Jun 2007 03:28:11 -0700, Donga <idomybestworkonabike@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Jun 23, 3:47 pm, Friday <nowh...@sometime.net.au> wrote:
>>> Johnny Sunset wrote:
>>>> On Jun 22, 8:44 pm, Friday wrote:
>>>>> ...People say all sorts of things to try and scare you off chinese products, I don't know
>>>>> why....
>>>> It may have nothing to do with the inherent quality of the product,
>>>> and everything to do with the conditions under which it is made.
>>>> --
>>>> Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
>>>> The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
>>> Well the Australian Howard government has brought in radical changes
>>> which aren't too dissimilar to labor conditions in third world countries
>>> so that doesn't bother me at all.
>>>
>>> Friday
>> As a matter of fact, the Howard Govt is trying to reduce worker
>> conditions to those in the US!
>
> Unemployment rate of 4.5%?
>
> Ron
I'm sure that slaves under the Egyptian pharaohs had full employment too.
Friday
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Date: 26 Jun 2007 12:53:58
From: RonSonic
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
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On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 23:05:05 +0800, Friday <nowhere@sometime.net.au > wrote:
>RonSonic wrote:
>> On Sat, 23 Jun 2007 03:28:11 -0700, Donga <idomybestworkonabike@hotmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On Jun 23, 3:47 pm, Friday <nowh...@sometime.net.au> wrote:
>>>> Johnny Sunset wrote:
>>>>> On Jun 22, 8:44 pm, Friday wrote:
>>>>>> ...People say all sorts of things to try and scare you off chinese products, I don't know
>>>>>> why....
>>>>> It may have nothing to do with the inherent quality of the product,
>>>>> and everything to do with the conditions under which it is made.
>>>>> --
>>>>> Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
>>>>> The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
>>>> Well the Australian Howard government has brought in radical changes
>>>> which aren't too dissimilar to labor conditions in third world countries
>>>> so that doesn't bother me at all.
>>>>
>>>> Friday
>>> As a matter of fact, the Howard Govt is trying to reduce worker
>>> conditions to those in the US!
>>
>> Unemployment rate of 4.5%?
>>
>> Ron
>
>I'm sure that slaves under the Egyptian pharaohs had full employment too.
We get to pick our jobs. Or whether or not we want one.
You can talk of the terror that is wage slavery and it'd all be basically
bullshit. Nobody has ever had more freedom to choose his work in whatever
portion he pleases than the modern American. Those who find they have limited
choices are only bordered by other choices they have made.
Ron
Ron
Effect pedal demo's up at http://www.soundclick.com/ronsonicpedalry
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Date: 26 Jun 2007 13:24:49
From: A Muzi
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
|
>>>>>> On Jun 22, 8:44 pm, Friday wrote:
>>>>>>> ...People say all sorts of things to try and scare you off chinese products, I don't know
>>>>>>> why....
>>>>> Johnny Sunset wrote:
>>>>>> It may have nothing to do with the inherent quality of the product,
>>>>>> and everything to do with the conditions under which it is made.
>>>> Friday <nowh...@sometime.net.au> wrote:
>>>>> Well the Australian Howard government has brought in radical changes
>>>>> which aren't too dissimilar to labor conditions in third world countries
>>>>> so that doesn't bother me at all.
>>> Donga <idomybestworkonabike@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>> As a matter of fact, the Howard Govt is trying to reduce worker
>>>> conditions to those in the US!
RonSonic wrote:
>>> Unemployment rate of 4.5%?
> Friday <nowhere@sometime.net.au> wrote:
>> I'm sure that slaves under the Egyptian pharaohs had full employment too.
RonSonic wrote:
> We get to pick our jobs. Or whether or not we want one.
> You can talk of the terror that is wage slavery and it'd all be basically
> bullshit. Nobody has ever had more freedom to choose his work in whatever
> portion he pleases than the modern American. Those who find they have limited
> choices are only bordered by other choices they have made.
Yes, the inherent beauty of "Equality of Opportunity" is poorly
understood now, I think. The alternate (removal of risk) seems always
to end with an enforced 'equality' based on 'let's cut the heads off the
tall ones'.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
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Date: 25 Jun 2007 09:05:10
From: Bill Sornson
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
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Friday wrote:
> RonSonic wrote:
>> On Sat, 23 Jun 2007 03:28:11 -0700, Donga
>> <idomybestworkonabike@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>> As a matter of fact, the Howard Govt is trying to reduce worker
>>> conditions to those in the US!
>> Unemployment rate of 4.5%?
> I'm sure that slaves under the Egyptian pharaohs had full employment
> too.
POTW LOL
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Date: 22 Jun 2007 22:05:06
From: Johnny Sunset
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
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On Jun 22, 8:44 pm, Friday wrote:
> ...People say all sorts of things to try and scare you off chinese products, I don't know
> why....
It may have nothing to do with the inherent quality of the product,
and everything to do with the conditions under which it is made.
--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
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Date: 24 Jun 2007 15:23:32
From: Phil
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
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Johnny Sunset wrote:
> On Jun 22, 8:44 pm, Friday wrote:
>> ...People say all sorts of things to try and scare you off chinese
>> products, I don't know why....
>
> It may have nothing to do with the inherent quality of the product,
> and everything to do with the conditions under which it is made.
You mean under a helium-filled local atmosphere? ;)
--
Phil
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Date: 23 Jun 2007 13:47:29
From: Friday
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
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Johnny Sunset wrote:
> On Jun 22, 8:44 pm, Friday wrote:
>> ...People say all sorts of things to try and scare you off chinese products, I don't know
>> why....
>
> It may have nothing to do with the inherent quality of the product,
> and everything to do with the conditions under which it is made.
>
> --
> Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
> The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
>
>
Well the Australian Howard government has brought in radical changes
which aren't too dissimilar to labor conditions in third world countries
so that doesn't bother me at all.
Friday
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Date: 22 Jun 2007 19:06:14
From: Donga
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
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On Jun 23, 11:44 am, Friday <nowh...@sometime.net.au > wrote:
> Hey that's my quote.
> I also have two other frames, a road bike and a triathlon bike with Ti
> frames from Changda. All are going well. I've had them for several years
> now but most of my riding has been on the mountain bike. People say all
> sorts of things to try and scare you off chinese products, I don't know
> why. I've had emails from many people around the world regarding
> Changda, some have had custom frames built up very cheaply.
>
> Friday
Did you deal direct with XACD and buy their standard frames? Was this
easy enough? How would you feel about speccing Changda to make a fixie
frame with track dropouts?
donga
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Date: 23 Jun 2007 13:45:01
From: Friday
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
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Donga wrote:
> On Jun 23, 11:44 am, Friday <nowh...@sometime.net.au> wrote:
>
>> Hey that's my quote.
>> I also have two other frames, a road bike and a triathlon bike with Ti
>> frames from Changda. All are going well. I've had them for several years
>> now but most of my riding has been on the mountain bike. People say all
>> sorts of things to try and scare you off chinese products, I don't know
>> why. I've had emails from many people around the world regarding
>> Changda, some have had custom frames built up very cheaply.
>>
>> Friday
>
> Did you deal direct with XACD and buy their standard frames? Was this
> easy enough? How would you feel about speccing Changda to make a fixie
> frame with track dropouts?
>
> donga
>
I dealt direct with them, and bought a standard frame. Hardest part was
wiring the money, local banks didn't seem to know what they were doing.
Send them an email and discuss it with them, they seem to be very
helpful and competent. I get the impression they make frames for a lot
of the big American manufacturers.
Friday
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Date: 24 Jun 2007 15:25:13
From: Phil
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
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Friday wrote:
> Donga wrote:
>> On Jun 23, 11:44 am, Friday <nowh...@sometime.net.au> wrote:
>>
>>> Hey that's my quote.
>>> I also have two other frames, a road bike and a triathlon bike with
>>> Ti frames from Changda. All are going well. I've had them for
>>> several years now but most of my riding has been on the mountain
>>> bike. People say all sorts of things to try and scare you off
>>> chinese products, I don't know why. I've had emails from many
>>> people around the world regarding Changda, some have had custom
>>> frames built up very cheaply.
>>> Friday
>>
>> Did you deal direct with XACD and buy their standard frames? Was this
>> easy enough? How would you feel about speccing Changda to make a
>> fixie frame with track dropouts?
>>
>> donga
>>
>
> I dealt direct with them, and bought a standard frame. Hardest part
> was wiring the money, local banks didn't seem to know what they were
> doing. Send them an email and discuss it with them, they seem to be
> very helpful and competent. I get the impression they make frames for
> a lot of the big American manufacturers.
>
> Friday
A friend of mine had a similar experience in speccing up his 64cm custom
frame with huge 3" main tubing. He is very happy with the stiffness, which
was his major concern.
--
Phil
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Date: 22 Jun 2007 18:29:18
From: Donga
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
|
On Jun 23, 7:28 am, coyote <coy...@id.su > wrote:
> I see quite some opinions on these frames on various forums, but very
> little real user experience.
> Could I ask people who have such a frame to post their experiences with
> them?
> Thanks!
http://tinyurl.com/25s4y2
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Date: 23 Jun 2007 09:44:24
From: Friday
Subject: Re: Changda/xacd frame experience
|
Donga wrote:
> On Jun 23, 7:28 am, coyote <coy...@id.su> wrote:
>> I see quite some opinions on these frames on various forums, but very
>> little real user experience.
>> Could I ask people who have such a frame to post their experiences with
>> them?
>> Thanks!
>
> http://tinyurl.com/25s4y2
>
Hey that's my quote.
I also have two other frames, a road bike and a triathlon bike with Ti
frames from Changda. All are going well. I've had them for several years
now but most of my riding has been on the mountain bike. People say all
sorts of things to try and scare you off chinese products, I don't know
why. I've had emails from many people around the world regarding
Changda, some have had custom frames built up very cheaply.
Friday
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