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Date: 14 Nov 2007 13:36:35
From:
Subject: Cyclocross wheels/tires on road bike?
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Sorry about yet another topic but there seems to be a difference
between official information and what is feasible in reality. This
wouldn't be so much of a problem if everyone wasn't so eager to sell
stuff.
I figured out that the only difference between a cyclocross bike and a
road bike appears to be cantilever brakes for clearance and knobbed
tires for grip. Maybe a bit of a sturdier frame but that appears to be
it.
Now, assuming I have enough clearance for the tires, can I pop in a
different set of wheels/tires and head into the nearest field ?
How much clearance should the tires have inside my caliper brakes? I
have a full Campy Veloce setup.
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Date: 15 Nov 2007 18:19:52
From: Tim McNamara
Subject: Re: Cyclocross wheels/tires on road bike?
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In article <1195047395.203347.136960@o80g2000hse.googlegroups.com >,
webhead@telenet.be wrote:
> Sorry about yet another topic but there seems to be a difference
> between official information and what is feasible in reality. This
> wouldn't be so much of a problem if everyone wasn't so eager to sell
> stuff.
>
> I figured out that the only difference between a cyclocross bike and
> a road bike appears to be cantilever brakes for clearance and knobbed
> tires for grip. Maybe a bit of a sturdier frame but that appears to
> be it.
There's more to it than that, but the differences are subtle enough that
they aren't immediately obvious- and subtle enough that you can race
cross on a road bike with enough clearance for the tires and some mud
and not be at a big disadvantage.
The other differences include a slightly higher bottom bracket (although
this is less pronounced than is used to be before clipless pedals),
slightly slacker head tube with slightly more fork offset, cable runs
that are out of the way when shouldering the bike, extended head tube to
put the bars a bit higher, slightly sloped top tube for standover
clearance, etc. But these really aren't "make or break" differences.
And I see lots of people riding on the road on cyclo-cross bikes, where
they also work fine. I put way more road miles on my 'cross bike than
off-road miles, and used my 'cross bike for brevets and PBP.
> Now, assuming I have enough clearance for the tires, can I pop in a
> different set of wheels/tires and head into the nearest field ? How
> much clearance should the tires have inside my caliper brakes? I have
> a full Campy Veloce setup.
You want at least 1 cm of clearance all the way around the tire at the
fork crown, rear brake and chainstays- unless you live somewhere where
it's generally not muddy.
I happily raced cross for several seasons on a 1979 Raleigh Super Course
with ca 1977 Dura Ace sidepulls and Ritchey 700 x 28 tires. There was
enough clearance that mud wasn't a problem. I later bought a Gunnar
'cross bike and found that the handling was just a bit better off road
and that the greater clearance was helpful. But it didn't make me
finish significantly higher in the race results... maybe one or two
places, but still out of the top five always and usually out of the top
ten.
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Date: 15 Nov 2007 13:36:12
From: webhead
Subject: Re: Cyclocross wheels/tires on road bike?
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On Nov 15, 6:48 am, BLT <reply@this_ng.com > wrote:
> Circa Wed, 14 Nov 2007 13:36:35 -0000, webh...@telenet.be typed:
>
> >I figured out that the only difference between a cyclocross bike and a
> >road bike appears to be cantilever brakes for clearance and knobbed
> >tires for grip.
>
> Also, longer chainstays for tire clearance behind the seat tube.
Thanks, this has been educational in a lot of ways. Maybe I can
convert a 80's bike to cyclocross standards. I've got one lying around
which seems to offer over an inch of clearance. Unfortunately it needs
a lot of work to get up to field status but I guess that's just
another passe-temps.
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Date: 15 Nov 2007 18:24:04
From: Tim McNamara
Subject: Re: Cyclocross wheels/tires on road bike?
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In article
<c7309f55-ea4a-4d61-897e-2956586c73cf@v4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com >,
webhead <webhead@telenet.be > wrote:
> On Nov 15, 6:48 am, BLT <reply@this_ng.com> wrote:
> > Circa Wed, 14 Nov 2007 13:36:35 -0000, webh...@telenet.be typed:
> >
> > >I figured out that the only difference between a cyclocross bike
> > >and a road bike appears to be cantilever brakes for clearance and
> > >knobbed tires for grip.
> >
> > Also, longer chainstays for tire clearance behind the seat tube.
>
> Thanks, this has been educational in a lot of ways. Maybe I can
> convert a 80's bike to cyclocross standards. I've got one lying
> around which seems to offer over an inch of clearance. Unfortunately
> it needs a lot of work to get up to field status but I guess that's
> just another passe-temps.
That would probably work just fine. Many of those 80s bikes came with
27" wheels, which gives you more clearance yet when you switch to 700C.
http://www.maddogmedia.com/crossnet/cheapcx.html
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Date: 14 Nov 2007 21:48:24
From: BLT
Subject: Re: Cyclocross wheels/tires on road bike?
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Circa Wed, 14 Nov 2007 13:36:35 -0000, webhead@telenet.be typed:
>I figured out that the only difference between a cyclocross bike and a
>road bike appears to be cantilever brakes for clearance and knobbed
>tires for grip.
Also, longer chainstays for tire clearance behind the seat tube.
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Date: 14 Nov 2007 17:18:18
From: Sir Ridesalot
Subject: Re: Cyclocross wheels/tires on road bike?
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On Nov 14, 8:36 am, webh...@telenet.be wrote:
> Sorry about yet another topic but there seems to be a difference
> between official information and what is feasible in reality. This
> wouldn't be so much of a problem if everyone wasn't so eager to sell
> stuff.
>
> I figured out that the only difference between a cyclocross bike and a
> road bike appears to be cantilever brakes for clearance and knobbed
> tires for grip. Maybe a bit of a sturdier frame but that appears to be
> it.
>
> Now, assuming I have enough clearance for the tires, can I pop in a
> different set of wheels/tires and head into the nearest field ?
> How much clearance should the tires have inside my caliper brakes? I
> have a full Campy Veloce setup.
Hi there..
If the bicycle is an older one you might be able to do it. I have
Schwalbe CX Pro 32s on my Miele circa 1985. That runs well but does
not allow fenfers. My Miele Uno from the same period takes both those
tyres and the fenders.
If it is a racing frame which it sounds like you have then I do not
thoink it will work. My brake calipers are 49 - 57 mm reach.
Cheers from Peter
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Date: 14 Nov 2007 21:29:29
From: M-gineering
Subject: Re: Cyclocross wheels/tires on road bike?
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webhead@telenet.be wrote:
> Sorry about yet another topic but there seems to be a difference
> between official information and what is feasible in reality. This
> wouldn't be so much of a problem if everyone wasn't so eager to sell
> stuff.
>
> I figured out that the only difference between a cyclocross bike and a
> road bike appears to be cantilever brakes for clearance and knobbed
> tires for grip. Maybe a bit of a sturdier frame but that appears to be
> it.
>
> Now, assuming I have enough clearance for the tires, can I pop in a
> different set of wheels/tires and head into the nearest field ?
> How much clearance should the tires have inside my caliper brakes? I
> have a full Campy Veloce setup.
>
You're assuming to much.
Stock veloce is 47mm reach brakes, so depending on the frame you're
lucky if you can squeeze a 28mm tyre in there. Remember, wider tyres are
taller too!. 35mm with knobby's or even a smoothish 30mm won't turn,
even without mud
--
/Marten
info(apestaartje)m-gineering(punt)nl
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Date: 14 Nov 2007 09:43:29
From: Kerry Montgomery
Subject: Re: Cyclocross wheels/tires on road bike?
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<webhead@telenet.be > wrote in message
news:1195047395.203347.136960@o80g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
> Sorry about yet another topic but there seems to be a difference
> between official information and what is feasible in reality. This
> wouldn't be so much of a problem if everyone wasn't so eager to sell
> stuff.
>
> I figured out that the only difference between a cyclocross bike and a
> road bike appears to be cantilever brakes for clearance and knobbed
> tires for grip. Maybe a bit of a sturdier frame but that appears to be
> it.
>
> Now, assuming I have enough clearance for the tires, can I pop in a
> different set of wheels/tires and head into the nearest field ?
> How much clearance should the tires have inside my caliper brakes? I
> have a full Campy Veloce setup.
>
Webhead,
You might start by seeing if you can even fit a knobby tire between the
brake blocks with the brake fully open. You may have to deflate the tire to
install, then inflate it after it's in place.
Kerry
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Date: 14 Nov 2007 09:37:55
From: bfd
Subject: Re: Cyclocross wheels/tires on road bike?
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On Nov 14, 8:15 am, webhead <webh...@telenet.be > wrote:
> Hm,
> How much is enough ;)
Well, technically you could take an old late 80s/early 90s touring
bike (i.e., Nishiki, Fuji, Univega, and many other UJB - Universal
Japanese Bike - from that era) with canti brakes and make that a
"cross" bike as it would have room for tires as wide as 700x30 or 32.
However, many may argue that those bikes would be *too heavy* to
actually race. But really what's too heavy?
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Date: 14 Nov 2007 16:15:41
From: webhead
Subject: Re: Cyclocross wheels/tires on road bike?
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Hm,
How much is enough ;)
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Date: 15 Nov 2007 01:40:34
From: Ryan Cousineau
Subject: Re: Cyclocross wheels/tires on road bike?
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In article <1195056941.537863.221860@o80g2000hse.googlegroups.com >,
webhead <webhead@telenet.be > wrote:
> Hm,
> How much is enough ;)
Heh. The question probably has more to do with how much abuse you're
willing to subject your frame's finish to than any other factor. In
short, close tolerances are inviting crap to get up between the tire and
frame (or fork) and then it just starts taking paint off. In the worst
case, a big chunk of whatever (bark mulch? Extremely clay-ey mud?) might
more or less impede the wheel's ability to turn at all.
Where you get into trouble is that moment when you realize that with
28mm inverted-tread hybrid tires, you can sort of make it work with
about 1mm under the brake arch. And then something 2mm in diameter tries
to come through...
In practice, I had a road bike with surprisingly good clearances, and I
really did run inverted-tread 28mm tires for a season of CX racing. I
stormed through the dry races, and then the second half of the season
was chaos, as found myself lying in the mud a lot.
Yes, it can be done if your bike has generous clearance. Most
caliper-braked road bikes don't have that much clearance, though some
older bikes (and many older bikes with "Racer"-style U-brakes) will
work.
The easiest non-cx bike to use is a canti-equipped tourer, or nowadays,
a disc-equipped one, too. A cheap second choice is an old rigid MTB: on
a lot of courses the fat tires are probably an advantage. After that, I
would use an old road bike with good clearance, or a hardtail MTB with
the fork as locked as possible.
It's bemusing, but an old MTB or an old road bike/tourer really is the
best way to go CXing on the cheap.
--
Ryan Cousineau rcousine@sfu.ca http://www.wiredcola.com/
"My scenarios may give the impression I could be an excellent crook.
Not true - I am a talented lawyer." - Sandy in rec.bicycles.racing
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Date: 14 Nov 2007 17:38:25
From: Kinky Cowboy
Subject: Re: Cyclocross wheels/tires on road bike?
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On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 16:15:41 -0000, webhead <webhead@telenet.be >
wrote:
>Hm,
>How much is enough ;)
You'll soon find out when it gets muddy. In a good sticky gloop, no
amount of clearance is enough.
A problem you've not mentioned yet is that you probably won't get a
fully inflated tyre through the gap between the brake pads, worth
remembering when you need to mend a puncture. Typical road tyres are
only 3-5mm wider than the rim, and the brake QR is designed around
this. A racing CX tyre is 10-15mm wider than the rim. Unhooking one
end of the straddle cable can accommodate this, a road brake QR can't
Kinky Cowboy*
*Batteries not included
May contain traces of nuts
Your milage may vary
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Date: 15 Nov 2007 01:38:34
From: daveornee
Subject: Re: Cyclocross wheels/tires on road bike?
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webhead@telenet.be Wrote:
> Sorry about yet another topic but there seems to be a difference
> between official information and what is feasible in reality. This
> wouldn't be so much of a problem if everyone wasn't so eager to sell
> stuff.
>
> I figured out that the only difference between a cyclocross bike and a
> road bike appears to be cantilever brakes for clearance and knobbed
> tires for grip. Maybe a bit of a sturdier frame but that appears to be
> it.
>
> Now, assuming I have enough clearance for the tires, can I pop in a
> different set of wheels/tires and head into the nearest field ?
> How much clearance should the tires have inside my caliper brakes? I
> have a full Campy Veloce setup.
Yes, "assuming I have enough clearance for the tires" is th
challenge!
Even when there is no mud involved it is often difficult to clear th
tires with standard road bicycling frames & components. In that kind o
riding mud usually adds to the clearance issues
--
daveornee
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