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Main
Date: 03 Oct 2007 11:23:52
From: Jim Higson
Subject: How far in should a Chorus left crank be?
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I removed and refitted a left crank recently, and now I've fitted it again
it just doesn't look far enough up the taper. I don't have a picture, but I
can't get over the feeling it was closer to the bb before. This is although
I've already tightened to the maximum torque.
I could be imagining things, but I remember there was only a very small gap
before and the crank "fitted into" the hollow around the BB. Now, I can
just about see the start of the square taper flat on the spindle over the
edge of the crank and I don't remember seeing these before I took it off.
Does anyone have a photo, or know of one online of how it should look?
Something like this:
http://www.merciancycles.com/gallery_images/pro track bicy hab 3 160.jpg
But with Chorus/Record and larger would be great.
This is with the alloy crank and asymetric square taper BB. I haven't ridden
since refitting.
Thanks for any help,
Jim
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Date: 03 Oct 2007 15:31:49
From: A Muzi
Subject: Re: How far in should a Chorus left crank be?
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Jim Higson wrote:
> I removed and refitted a left crank recently, and now I've fitted it again
> it just doesn't look far enough up the taper. I don't have a picture, but I
> can't get over the feeling it was closer to the bb before. This is although
> I've already tightened to the maximum torque.
>
> I could be imagining things, but I remember there was only a very small gap
> before and the crank "fitted into" the hollow around the BB. Now, I can
> just about see the start of the square taper flat on the spindle over the
> edge of the crank and I don't remember seeing these before I took it off.
>
> Does anyone have a photo, or know of one online of how it should look?
> Something like this:
>
> http://www.merciancycles.com/gallery_images/pro track bicy hab 3 160.jpg
>
> But with Chorus/Record and larger would be great.
>
> This is with the alloy crank and asymetric square taper BB. I haven't ridden
> since refitting.
If it seems important, there are marks inside the arm's taper showing
the limit of the spindle's penetration.
This is the same crank on the same spindle, right? Or did you replace
something? You did lube the bolt threads and the surface under the
bolt's head, right? (Taper lubrication is left to your taste.) And
you're pretty sure your torque's 40 Nm not 4 Nm right?
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
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Date: 03 Oct 2007 23:07:29
From: Jim Higson
Subject: Re: How far in should a Chorus left crank be?
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A Muzi wrote:
> Jim Higson wrote:
>> I removed and refitted a left crank recently, and now I've fitted it
>> again it just doesn't look far enough up the taper. I don't have a
>> picture, but I can't get over the feeling it was closer to the bb before.
>> This is although I've already tightened to the maximum torque.
>>
>> I could be imagining things, but I remember there was only a very small
>> gap before and the crank "fitted into" the hollow around the BB. Now, I
>> can just about see the start of the square taper flat on the spindle over
>> the edge of the crank and I don't remember seeing these before I took it
>> off.
>>
>> Does anyone have a photo, or know of one online of how it should look?
>> Something like this:
>>
>> http://www.merciancycles.com/gallery_images/pro track bicy hab 3 160.jpg
>>
>> But with Chorus/Record and larger would be great.
>>
>> This is with the alloy crank and asymetric square taper BB. I haven't
>> ridden since refitting.
>
> If it seems important, there are marks inside the arm's taper showing
> the limit of the spindle's penetration.
I had never noticed this, I'll take a look.
> This is the same crank on the same spindle, right? Or did you replace
> something?
All the same equipment.
> You did lube the bolt threads and the surface under the
> bolt's head, right?
I lubed both under the bolt and both sides of the washer. A little on the
threads too, but not too much since I didn't want to mess with the
threadlock that comes on there.
> (Taper lubrication is left to your taste.) And
> you're pretty sure your torque's 40 Nm not 4 Nm right?
Yep! Almost as hard as I can push the wrench!
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Date: 03 Oct 2007 06:34:13
From: Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com
Subject: Re: How far in should a Chorus left crank be?
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On Oct 3, 6:59 am, Jim Higson <j...@aber.ac.uk > wrote:
> Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.comwrote:
>
>
>
> > On Oct 3, 4:23 am, Jim Higson <j...@aber.ac.uk> wrote:
> >> I removed and refitted a left crank recently, and now I've fitted it
> >> again it just doesn't look far enough up the taper. I don't have a
> >> picture, but I can't get over the feeling it was closer to the bb before.
> >> This is although I've already tightened to the maximum torque.
>
> >> I could be imagining things, but I remember there was only a very small
> >> gap before and the crank "fitted into" the hollow around the BB. Now, I
> >> can just about see the start of the square taper flat on the spindle over
> >> the edge of the crank and I don't remember seeing these before I took it
> >> off.
>
> >> Does anyone have a photo, or know of one online of how it should look?
> >> Something like this:
>
> >>http://www.merciancycles.com/gallery_images/protrackbicy hab 3 160.jpg
>
> >> But with Chorus/Record and larger would be great.
>
> >> This is with the alloy crank and asymetric square taper BB. I haven't
> >> ridden since refitting.
>
> >> Thanks for any help,
> >> Jim
>
> > Asymmetric? 102mm BB is symmetrical..triple??
>
> Sorry, 102mm, standard double. Asymmetric BB - the one that is fitted with
> the same tool as the cassette.
>
> > BUT dry spindle and torque wrench and it will stay on and be in the
> > proper place.
>
> I must admit, I did apply grease to the bolt and washers, but not the
> spindle.
>
> Out of interest now, Would greasing the spindle put the crank futher "in"
> because of less friction, or "out" because of more material in the hole?
>
> Thanks for the answer,
> Jim
Here we go..I think Campagnolo recommended a dry spindle and a set
amount of torque so they could predict how far the crank would be
drawn onto the spindle that way..with grease and the same torque, it
will go farther onto the spindle but I think you are obsessing about
how it may 'look', not how it may 'work'...
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Date: 03 Oct 2007 15:05:40
From: Jim Higson
Subject: Re: How far in should a Chorus left crank be?
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Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com wrote:
> On Oct 3, 6:59 am, Jim Higson <j...@aber.ac.uk> wrote:
>> Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.comwrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> > On Oct 3, 4:23 am, Jim Higson <j...@aber.ac.uk> wrote:
>> >> I removed and refitted a left crank recently, and now I've fitted it
>> >> again it just doesn't look far enough up the taper. I don't have a
>> >> picture, but I can't get over the feeling it was closer to the bb
>> >> before. This is although I've already tightened to the maximum torque.
>>
>> >> I could be imagining things, but I remember there was only a very
>> >> small gap before and the crank "fitted into" the hollow around the BB.
>> >> Now, I can just about see the start of the square taper flat on the
>> >> spindle over the edge of the crank and I don't remember seeing these
>> >> before I took it off.
>>
>> >> Does anyone have a photo, or know of one online of how it should look?
>> >> Something like this:
>>
>> >>http://www.merciancycles.com/gallery_images/protrackbicy hab 3 160.jpg
>>
>> >> But with Chorus/Record and larger would be great.
>>
>> >> This is with the alloy crank and asymetric square taper BB. I haven't
>> >> ridden since refitting.
>>
>> >> Thanks for any help,
>> >> Jim
>>
>> > Asymmetric? 102mm BB is symmetrical..triple??
>>
>> Sorry, 102mm, standard double. Asymmetric BB - the one that is fitted
>> with the same tool as the cassette.
>>
>> > BUT dry spindle and torque wrench and it will stay on and be in the
>> > proper place.
>>
>> I must admit, I did apply grease to the bolt and washers, but not the
>> spindle.
>>
>> Out of interest now, Would greasing the spindle put the crank futher "in"
>> because of less friction, or "out" because of more material in the hole?
>>
>> Thanks for the answer,
>> Jim
>
> Here we go..I think Campagnolo recommended a dry spindle and a set
> amount of torque so they could predict how far the crank would be
> drawn onto the spindle that way..with grease and the same torque, it
> will go farther onto the spindle but I think you are obsessing about
> how it may 'look', not how it may 'work'...
Probably. Or how I remember it looking without taking too much attention.
I'll just leave it and get out and ride - thanks for putting my mind at
rest.
Campagnolo deffinatly say not to grease. They put it in bold capitals in the
manual. The torque range they give is 32-38Nm, and I have it to about
35-40, so only a touch over. (I can't really push any more accurately that
hard than to within 5Nm with my Park Tools Torque wrench)
--
Jim
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Date: 03 Oct 2007 17:19:30
From: Jim Higson
Subject: Re: How far in should a Chorus left crank be?
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Jim Higson wrote:
> Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com wrote:
>
>> On Oct 3, 6:59 am, Jim Higson <j...@aber.ac.uk> wrote:
>>> Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.comwrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> > On Oct 3, 4:23 am, Jim Higson <j...@aber.ac.uk> wrote:
>>> >> I removed and refitted a left crank recently, and now I've fitted it
>>> >> again it just doesn't look far enough up the taper. I don't have a
>>> >> picture, but I can't get over the feeling it was closer to the bb
>>> >> before. This is although I've already tightened to the maximum
>>> >> torque.
>>>
>>> >> I could be imagining things, but I remember there was only a very
>>> >> small gap before and the crank "fitted into" the hollow around the
>>> >> BB. Now, I can just about see the start of the square taper flat on
>>> >> the spindle over the edge of the crank and I don't remember seeing
>>> >> these before I took it off.
>>>
>>> >> Does anyone have a photo, or know of one online of how it should
>>> >> look? Something like this:
>>>
>>> >>http://www.merciancycles.com/gallery_images/protrackbicy hab 3 160.jpg
>>>
>>> >> But with Chorus/Record and larger would be great.
>>>
>>> >> This is with the alloy crank and asymetric square taper BB. I haven't
>>> >> ridden since refitting.
>>>
>>> >> Thanks for any help,
>>> >> Jim
>>>
>>> > Asymmetric? 102mm BB is symmetrical..triple??
>>>
>>> Sorry, 102mm, standard double. Asymmetric BB - the one that is fitted
>>> with the same tool as the cassette.
>>>
>>> > BUT dry spindle and torque wrench and it will stay on and be in the
>>> > proper place.
>>>
>>> I must admit, I did apply grease to the bolt and washers, but not the
>>> spindle.
>>>
>>> Out of interest now, Would greasing the spindle put the crank futher
>>> "in" because of less friction, or "out" because of more material in the
>>> hole?
>>>
>>> Thanks for the answer,
>>> Jim
>>
>> Here we go..I think Campagnolo recommended a dry spindle and a set
>> amount of torque so they could predict how far the crank would be
>> drawn onto the spindle that way..with grease and the same torque, it
>> will go farther onto the spindle but I think you are obsessing about
>> how it may 'look', not how it may 'work'...
>
> Probably. Or how I remember it looking without taking too much attention.
> I'll just leave it and get out and ride - thanks for putting my mind at
> rest.
>
> Campagnolo deffinatly say not to grease. They put it in bold capitals in
> the manual. The torque range they give is 32-38Nm, and I have it to about
> 35-40, so only a touch over. (I can't really push any more accurately that
> hard than to within 5Nm with my Park Tools Torque wrench)
I was just looking for advice from the installation document on the
Campagnolo site and it looks like their site is parked by a domain camper!
Until they fix it, I found equivalent information from Park Tool here:
http://www.parktool.com/repair/readhowto.asp?id=103
Their advice is pretty much the same as Peters - don't grease the spindle
and use the recommended torque.
Thanks again.
Jim
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Date: 03 Oct 2007 19:14:40
From: A Muzi
Subject: Re: How far in should a Chorus left crank be?
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Jim Higson wrote:
> I was just looking for advice from the installation document on the
> Campagnolo site and it looks like their site is parked by a domain camper!
comes up with my usual bookmark:
http://campagnolousa.com/
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
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Date: 03 Oct 2007 20:05:05
From: Lou Holtman
Subject: Re: How far in should a Chorus left crank be?
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Jim Higson wrote:
>
> Their advice is pretty much the same as Peters - don't grease the spindle
> and use the recommended torque.
>
> Thanks again.
> Jim
Mayby these pictures help (no grease, torqued to spec)
102 symm BB and compact crank with a 0.5 mm offset to the right (spacer):
http://home.planet.nl/~holtm072/plaatjes/102symmCompactRecordCrank.JPG
111 mm assym BB and a triple crank:
http://home.planet.nl/~holtm072/plaatjes/111asymmTripleRecordCrank.JPG
Lou
--
Posted by news://news.nb.nu (http://www.nb.nu)
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Date: 03 Oct 2007 21:07:25
From: Jim Higson
Subject: Re: How far in should a Chorus left crank be?
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Lou Holtman wrote:
> Jim Higson wrote:
>
>>
>> Their advice is pretty much the same as Peters - don't grease the spindle
>> and use the recommended torque.
>>
>> Thanks again.
>> Jim
>
> Mayby these pictures help (no grease, torqued to spec)
Yes, thanks. My alloy cranks don't have that pale yellow bit that fits into
the BB so I can't use this in a direct comparison. However, the overall
closeness looks very similar to mine.
When viewed directly above, in the plane of the face at the end of the BB,
my left crank leaves only a *very tiny* part of the spindle visible.
From the design of the parts, it looks kinda like the BB is leaving a hollow
for the crank to fit into, but I suppose this isn't the case.
Thanks again,
Jim
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Date: 03 Oct 2007 05:46:40
From: Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com
Subject: Re: How far in should a Chorus left crank be?
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On Oct 3, 4:23 am, Jim Higson <j...@aber.ac.uk > wrote:
> I removed and refitted a left crank recently, and now I've fitted it again
> it just doesn't look far enough up the taper. I don't have a picture, but I
> can't get over the feeling it was closer to the bb before. This is although
> I've already tightened to the maximum torque.
>
> I could be imagining things, but I remember there was only a very small gap
> before and the crank "fitted into" the hollow around the BB. Now, I can
> just about see the start of the square taper flat on the spindle over the
> edge of the crank and I don't remember seeing these before I took it off.
>
> Does anyone have a photo, or know of one online of how it should look?
> Something like this:
>
> http://www.merciancycles.com/gallery_images/protrack bicy hab 3 160.jpg
>
> But with Chorus/Record and larger would be great.
>
> This is with the alloy crank and asymetric square taper BB. I haven't ridden
> since refitting.
>
> Thanks for any help,
> Jim
Asymmetric? 102mm BB is symmetrical..triple??
BUT dry spindle and torque wrench and it will stay on and be in the
proper place.
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Date: 03 Oct 2007 13:59:55
From: Jim Higson
Subject: Re: How far in should a Chorus left crank be?
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Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com wrote:
> On Oct 3, 4:23 am, Jim Higson <j...@aber.ac.uk> wrote:
>> I removed and refitted a left crank recently, and now I've fitted it
>> again it just doesn't look far enough up the taper. I don't have a
>> picture, but I can't get over the feeling it was closer to the bb before.
>> This is although I've already tightened to the maximum torque.
>>
>> I could be imagining things, but I remember there was only a very small
>> gap before and the crank "fitted into" the hollow around the BB. Now, I
>> can just about see the start of the square taper flat on the spindle over
>> the edge of the crank and I don't remember seeing these before I took it
>> off.
>>
>> Does anyone have a photo, or know of one online of how it should look?
>> Something like this:
>>
>> http://www.merciancycles.com/gallery_images/protrack bicy hab 3 160.jpg
>>
>> But with Chorus/Record and larger would be great.
>>
>> This is with the alloy crank and asymetric square taper BB. I haven't
>> ridden since refitting.
>>
>> Thanks for any help,
>> Jim
>
> Asymmetric? 102mm BB is symmetrical..triple??
Sorry, 102mm, standard double. Asymmetric BB - the one that is fitted with
the same tool as the cassette.
> BUT dry spindle and torque wrench and it will stay on and be in the
> proper place.
I must admit, I did apply grease to the bolt and washers, but not the
spindle.
Out of interest now, Would greasing the spindle put the crank futher "in"
because of less friction, or "out" because of more material in the hole?
Thanks for the answer,
Jim
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