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Date: 17 Jun 2007 09:59:06
From: joseph.santaniello@gmail.com
Subject: Latex innertubes more puncture resistant?
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So are latex tubes actually more puncture resistant than butyl tubes?
Recently I have gotten at least one flat every time I ride in the
rain. I have tried 6 different brands/models of tires and I have
suffered at least one flat with each one. These are punctures from
small sharp stones (don't get me started on whether the are flints or
not!) that get embedded in the tire and cut through to the tube.
I am going crazy. I need to find a good performance oriented tire
700x23 or 25 that survives wet weather with the types of sharp stones
all over the place here. Or if latex is more resilient, maybe it will
do the trick. Solutions that increase rolling resistance significantly
are not an option.
Joseph
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Date: 18 Jun 2007 09:30:18
From: * * Chas
Subject: Re: Latex innertubes more puncture resistant?
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<joseph.santaniello@gmail.com > wrote in message
news:1182099546.417308.174720@n2g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>
> So are latex tubes actually more puncture resistant than butyl tubes?
> Recently I have gotten at least one flat every time I ride in the
> rain. I have tried 6 different brands/models of tires and I have
> suffered at least one flat with each one. These are punctures from
> small sharp stones (don't get me started on whether the are flints or
> not!) that get embedded in the tire and cut through to the tube.
>
> I am going crazy. I need to find a good performance oriented tire
> 700x23 or 25 that survives wet weather with the types of sharp stones
> all over the place here. Or if latex is more resilient, maybe it will
> do the trick. Solutions that increase rolling resistance significantly
> are not an option.
>
> Joseph
>
I remember a long time ago, someone was marketing a latex tube that they
claimed was more resistant to punctures than regular tubes. They showed
pictures in their advertising of a sharp object stretching their latex
tube and penetrating a standard tube.
They were expensive and our limited testing was inconclusive.
The other issue was having to pump up the tires before every ride.
Chas.
Chas.
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Date: 18 Jun 2007 09:39:11
From: Larry Dickman
Subject: Re: Latex innertubes more puncture resistant?
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In article <OY2dnQNH5oyPLuvbnZ2dnUVZ_riknZ2d@comcast.com >,
"* * Chas" <verktygjunk@aol.spamski.com > wrote:
> <joseph.santaniello@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1182099546.417308.174720@n2g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
> >
> > So are latex tubes actually more puncture resistant than butyl tubes?
> > Recently I have gotten at least one flat every time I ride in the
> > rain. I have tried 6 different brands/models of tires and I have
> > suffered at least one flat with each one. These are punctures from
> > small sharp stones (don't get me started on whether the are flints or
> > not!) that get embedded in the tire and cut through to the tube.
> I remember a long time ago, someone was marketing a latex tube that they
> claimed was more resistant to punctures than regular tubes. They showed
> pictures in their advertising of a sharp object stretching their latex
> tube and penetrating a standard tube.
I used to use the Air-B butylized latex tubes (the advantage of these
over regular latex is that they leaked down slower, but still more than
regular butyls). I stopped using them because, on several occasions,
when I flatted the tube ripped open in one long rip. I think they are
more fragile than regular butyls and thus I do not want to risk a sudden
flat which could cause a crash.
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Date: 17 Jun 2007 21:29:04
From: Pat
Subject: Re: Latex innertubes more puncture resistant?
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I dunno about the tubes, but some friends of mine who ride tandems tell me
their longest lasting tires are alligators or gatorskins, or something like
that. You might want to look up those terms. I think the tires have extra
strong casing.
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Date: 17 Jun 2007 13:34:18
From: g
Subject: Re: Latex innertubes more puncture resistant?
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Hi Joseph,
If you want to talk about tubes then tubes. If rather you want to talk about
tires then the worst puncture tire that I bought and had numerous flats was
hutchinson carbon comp. My bike came with irc red storm never got a flat.
Right now I am using continental ultra. A week ago I hit a stone in the rear
tire. It poped like a bullet out from under the tire "twang." The tube
developed a slow leak and I just replaced it rather than try to fix it. I
don't know if it punctured or the stem seal is bad or what. For that one I
am not blaming puncture. I kind of like the continental ultra for the ride
and the price. I tried some of the forte' road tire by performance bike for
my peugeot which runs the older 27 1/4" rim, the tire however is 27 1/8", I
don't believe any big difference, these tires are good riding tires. I
haven't had a flat on the performance bike brand tire yet.
Talking about tubes, I was using the performance brand tube. I flatted about
20 miles from home. I pulled out my brand new tube from my saddle pack
(6months in the pack), and installed it on the bike and proceeded to pump it
up. It wouldn't hold any air. I kept trying, thinking it was the pump, I
checked if the pump was the problem. The pump wsa ok and then I kept pumping
and listening for air escaping. I couldn't hear anything, and the tire was
not inflating even the least bit. So I finally removed the tube from the
tire again (the new tube) and it had numerous 1 inch long splits in the
seam. I don't know why, but I walked in my stocking feet to the nearest bike
shop and - it turned out to be Performance bike about a mile away. They gave
me a replacement tube. Since then I changed out for continental tubes.
Haven't had a flat on the continental tubes yet.
<joseph.santaniello@gmail.com > wrote in message
news:1182099546.417308.174720@n2g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>
> So are latex tubes actually more puncture resistant than butyl tubes?
> Recently I have gotten at least one flat every time I ride in the
> rain. I have tried 6 different brands/models of tires and I have
> suffered at least one flat with each one. These are punctures from
> small sharp stones (don't get me started on whether the are flints or
> not!) that get embedded in the tire and cut through to the tube.
>
> I am going crazy. I need to find a good performance oriented tire
> 700x23 or 25 that survives wet weather with the types of sharp stones
> all over the place here. Or if latex is more resilient, maybe it will
> do the trick. Solutions that increase rolling resistance significantly
> are not an option.
>
> Joseph
>
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Date: 17 Jun 2007 13:01:11
From:
Subject: Re: Latex innertubes more puncture resistant?
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On Sun, 17 Jun 2007 09:59:06 -0700, "joseph.santaniello@gmail.com"
<joseph.santaniello@gmail.com > wrote:
>
>So are latex tubes actually more puncture resistant than butyl tubes?
>Recently I have gotten at least one flat every time I ride in the
>rain. I have tried 6 different brands/models of tires and I have
>suffered at least one flat with each one. These are punctures from
>small sharp stones (don't get me started on whether the are flints or
>not!) that get embedded in the tire and cut through to the tube.
>
>I am going crazy. I need to find a good performance oriented tire
>700x23 or 25 that survives wet weather with the types of sharp stones
>all over the place here. Or if latex is more resilient, maybe it will
>do the trick. Solutions that increase rolling resistance significantly
>are not an option.
>
>Joseph
Dear Joseph,
Latex tubes resist pinch flats better than butyl tubes because latex
squashes more than butyl before it splits.
In other words, a stiffer butyl tube of the same thickness will split
before a squashier latex tube if you drape them over an anvil and hit
them with a hammer.
Neither kind of rubber stands up to cutting flints or piercing thorns.
Bicyclists have complained about flints for over a century.
Even on solid tires, round-the-world highwheel-riders hated flints:
"Thomas Stevens crossed the Austrian frontier the morning of the 28th
of May, expecting to reach Vienna in about three days. The roads about
Munich are described as abominable stretches of loose flints."
--Outing magazine 1885
http://www.aafla.org/SportsLibrary/Outing/Volume_06/outVI05/outVI05t.pdf
Complaints about flints increased after pneumatic tires appeared:
"The surface of the road however improves [in Brittany]. He [the
rider] must keep to the route Nationale, or he will fall among the
flint stones east of Chinon. . . . Would that the roads were strewn
with this rock [probably limestone] instead of the flint that covers
them from this point on to Chinon, for a viler road I have not found
in France!"
--Outing magazine 1897
http://www.aafla.org/SportsLibrary/Outing/Volume_31/outXXXI03/outXXXI03g.pdf
"In parts of England the flint roads play sad havoc with your tires,
and a special tire is largely used for touring in those localities."
--Outing magazine 1898
http://www.aafla.org/SportsLibrary/Outing/Volume_32/outXXXII03/outXXXII03zc.pdf
"The roads are full of sharp little stones — the French call them
'silex' — and punctures are plentiful."
--Outing magazine 1899
http://www.aafla.org/SportsLibrary/Outing/Volume_34/outXXXIV03/outXXXIV03h.pdf
Most threads about flint-flats end up recommending thicker tires with
built-in Kevlar belts or tough plastic tire liners.
Cheers,
Carl Fogel
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Date: 17 Jun 2007 11:28:21
From: joseph.santaniello@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Latex innertubes more puncture resistant?
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On Jun 17, 7:43 pm, "Sandy" <leu...@frree.fr > wrote:
> Dans le message denews:1182099546.417308.174720@n2g2000hse.googlegroups.c=
om,
> joseph.santanie...@gmail.com <joseph.santanie...@gmail.com> a r=E9fl=E9ch=
i, et
> puis a d=E9clar=E9 :
>
> > So are latex tubes actually more puncture resistant than butyl tubes?
> > Recently I have gotten at least one flat every time I ride in the
> > rain. I have tried 6 different brands/models of tires and I have
> > suffered at least one flat with each one. These are punctures from
> > small sharp stones (don't get me started on whether the are flints or
> > not!) that get embedded in the tire and cut through to the tube.
>
> > I am going crazy. I need to find a good performance oriented tire
> > 700x23 or 25 that survives wet weather with the types of sharp stones
> > all over the place here. Or if latex is more resilient, maybe it will
> > do the trick. Solutions that increase rolling resistance significantly
> > are not an option.
>
> > Joseph
>
> My winter tire - Vittoria EVO-KX. 7000 km on the first rear, two glass
> shard flats. 9000 on the front, still going strong. Second rear 2000 km
> and fine. They do like a little extra pressure, compared to usual
> rain/winter tires. Excellent rating for crr in Le Cycle.
Lately I've been using the Vittoria Pave EVO CG which I like for the
extra wide casing. I've got about 2000km on them (the rear is soon
ripe for replacement) and they are great except both times it rained I
got a flat. I guess the positive way to look at it is I rode 2000km
with only 2 rain days! (I usually use another bike in the rain.) I'd
expect the Pave to be at least a bit tougher than the KX, or do you
suppose it's just a bigger casing and that's it?
Joseph
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Date: 17 Jun 2007 20:52:28
From: Sandy
Subject: Re: Latex innertubes more puncture resistant?
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Dans le message de
news:1182104901.499250.212650@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com,
joseph.santaniello@gmail.com <joseph.santaniello@gmail.com > a réfléchi, et
puis a déclaré :
> On Jun 17, 7:43 pm, "Sandy" <leu...@frree.fr> wrote:
>> Dans le message
>> denews:1182099546.417308.174720@n2g2000hse.googlegroups.com,
>> joseph.santanie...@gmail.com <joseph.santanie...@gmail.com> a
>> réfléchi, et puis a déclaré :
>>
>>> So are latex tubes actually more puncture resistant than butyl
>>> tubes? Recently I have gotten at least one flat every time I ride
>>> in the rain. I have tried 6 different brands/models of tires and I
>>> have suffered at least one flat with each one. These are punctures
>>> from small sharp stones (don't get me started on whether the are
>>> flints or not!) that get embedded in the tire and cut through to
>>> the tube.
>>
>>> I am going crazy. I need to find a good performance oriented tire
>>> 700x23 or 25 that survives wet weather with the types of sharp
>>> stones all over the place here. Or if latex is more resilient,
>>> maybe it will do the trick. Solutions that increase rolling
>>> resistance significantly are not an option.
>>
>>> Joseph
>>
>> My winter tire - Vittoria EVO-KX. 7000 km on the first rear, two
>> glass shard flats. 9000 on the front, still going strong. Second
>> rear 2000 km and fine. They do like a little extra pressure,
>> compared to usual rain/winter tires. Excellent rating for crr in Le
>> Cycle.
>
> Lately I've been using the Vittoria Pave EVO CG which I like for the
> extra wide casing. I've got about 2000km on them (the rear is soon
> ripe for replacement) and they are great except both times it rained I
> got a flat. I guess the positive way to look at it is I rode 2000km
> with only 2 rain days! (I usually use another bike in the rain.) I'd
> expect the Pave to be at least a bit tougher than the KX, or do you
> suppose it's just a bigger casing and that's it?
>
> Joseph
Well, I try not to recommend + or - a product I have no experience with. In
my club, lots of guys like the KX, others prefer the Michelin Pro Grip.
These are competition oriented riders. They are not, however, of your
generous human proportions. I think the Pavé is intended for pavé and
rotten roads.
You also asked whether latex tubes help. In the latter part of the last
century, while I used tubulars, those with latex tubes did fare better with
flats. I once rode a good 10 km with a construction staple right through a
tire, and lost pressure only when I took it out. On the other hand, I don't
find any better luck with flats today, with clinchers. But I don't get a
lot of flats, especially.
--
--
Sandy
--
Si les autres parties du monde ont des singes ; l'Europe a des Français.
Cela se compense.
[Arthur Schopenhauer]
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Date: 17 Jun 2007 19:43:14
From: Sandy
Subject: Re: Latex innertubes more puncture resistant?
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Dans le message de
news:1182099546.417308.174720@n2g2000hse.googlegroups.com,
joseph.santaniello@gmail.com <joseph.santaniello@gmail.com > a réfléchi, et
puis a déclaré :
> So are latex tubes actually more puncture resistant than butyl tubes?
> Recently I have gotten at least one flat every time I ride in the
> rain. I have tried 6 different brands/models of tires and I have
> suffered at least one flat with each one. These are punctures from
> small sharp stones (don't get me started on whether the are flints or
> not!) that get embedded in the tire and cut through to the tube.
>
> I am going crazy. I need to find a good performance oriented tire
> 700x23 or 25 that survives wet weather with the types of sharp stones
> all over the place here. Or if latex is more resilient, maybe it will
> do the trick. Solutions that increase rolling resistance significantly
> are not an option.
>
> Joseph
My winter tire - Vittoria EVO-KX. 7000 km on the first rear, two glass
shard flats. 9000 on the front, still going strong. Second rear 2000 km
and fine. They do like a little extra pressure, compared to usual
rain/winter tires. Excellent rating for crr in Le Cycle.
--
Bonne route !
Sandy
Verneuil-sur-Seine FR
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Date: 17 Jun 2007 10:05:39
From: g
Subject: Re: Latex innertubes more puncture resistant?
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try panaracer brand...
Panaracer Stradius Sport Tg
http://www.panaracer.com/eng/products/road/race.html#e
<joseph.santaniello@gmail.com > wrote in message
news:1182099546.417308.174720@n2g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
>
> So are latex tubes actually more puncture resistant than butyl tubes?
> Recently I have gotten at least one flat every time I ride in the
> rain. I have tried 6 different brands/models of tires and I have
> suffered at least one flat with each one. These are punctures from
> small sharp stones (don't get me started on whether the are flints or
> not!) that get embedded in the tire and cut through to the tube.
>
> I am going crazy. I need to find a good performance oriented tire
> 700x23 or 25 that survives wet weather with the types of sharp stones
> all over the place here. Or if latex is more resilient, maybe it will
> do the trick. Solutions that increase rolling resistance significantly
> are not an option.
>
> Joseph
>
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