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Main
Date: 11 Oct 2007 08:41:03
From: Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com
Subject: Tubies, just for info
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Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
these days...
http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
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Date: 15 Oct 2007 15:44:37
From: Dave
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for an expensive PIA
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On Oct 11, 8:59 am, Ozark Bicycle
<bicycleatel...@ozarkbicycleservice.com > wrote:
> On Oct 11, 10:41 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com"
>
> <pe...@vecchios.com> wrote:
> > Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
> > these days...
>
> >http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>
> Holy rolling feces, Batman, look at dem prices! Almost $50 for a *#
> %^&#*^ Conti sprinter! That's f***ing insane! No wonder almost no one
> uses the damn things anymore.
I made the mistake of buying a pair of Sprinters recently...The
casings were straight as an arrow and seemed to be of good quality.
BUT after around 500 miles the rear developed a slow leak. I cut open
the casing to find that the seam stitching had seriously abraded the
butyl tube along its whole underside, and had worn completely through
in the spot where I had the puncture. With the coarse stitching and
lack of a protective layer for the tube, this tire seems designed to
self-destruct.
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Date: 15 Oct 2007 07:54:19
From: smokey
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
On Oct 13, 9:37 pm, Tom Sherman <sunsetss0...@yahoo.com > wrote:
> Ted Bennett wrote:
> > Tom Sherman <sunsetss0...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >> Andrew Muzi mused:
> >>>>> Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.comwrote:
> >>>>>> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
> >>>>>> these days...
> >>>>>>http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
> >>>> Andrew Muzi mused:
> >>>>> Yikes! I noticed a big void where the $20 tire section s'posa be!
> >>> Tom Sherman wrote:
> >>>> They list the "Paris Roubaix Silk" as a "Great tire for touring". At
> >>>> $210.50 each, with a few spares (who wants to fix tubulars while on a
> >>>> tour), the tires will cost more than the bicycle. Sheesh!
> >>>> Sillier than brifters on a touring bicycle.
> >>> Uhh, that particular item is not out of line. If you can find a handmade
> >>> silk at all now.
> >> What real advantage will spending $421 do for the TOURING cyclist that
> >> $60 for a pair of high quality clinchers would not? Would any of the
> >> (alleged) advantages of tubulars apply to a loaded touring bicycle?
> >> Would you want to descend a mountain pass on a loaded touring bike with
> >> a field replaced tubular?
>
> > Now you're channeling Jobst, who is also a great poo-poo-er of tubies.
>
> > The reduced chance of a pinch flat is one argument in favor.
>
> Even if this is true (Jobst writes otherwise), it would be a risk I
> would take for ~$360, which buys a lot of tube patches and replacement
> tubes.
>
> Of course, my personal experience suggests that pinch flats are a myth,
> punctures are rare, but flats from tubes tearing and valves leaking are
> not uncommon (relatively speaking).
>
> >> Would you want to descend a mountain pass on a loaded touring bike with
> >> a field replaced tubular?
>
> > Non, bien sur. That's the dealbreaker for me in that application....
>
> I would not enjoy the ride if I had reason to believe that the tire was
> less than optimally attached to the rim. This for me would outweigh the
> touted "tubular benefits".
>
> --
> Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
> Beer - It's not just for breakfast anymore!- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
"Of course, my personal experience suggests that pinch flats are a
myth,"
Wrong. Ride on rough enough roads long enough and you will get the
dreaded snakebite flat, I've had several myself.
Smokey
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Date: 17 Oct 2007 19:46:11
From: Tom Sherman
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
Smokey Strodtman wrote:
> On Oct 13, 9:37 pm, Tom Sherman <sunsetss0...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
> "Of course, my personal experience suggests that pinch flats are a
> myth,"
>
> Wrong. Ride on rough enough roads long enough and you will get the
> dreaded snakebite flat, I've had several myself.
Note that I was not claiming that NO ONE ELSE never had pinch flats.
Of course, it has been years since I have ridden significant distances
(other that two (2) metric centuries) on tires less than 33-mm wide.
--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
Beer - It's not just for breakfast anymore!
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Date: 19 Oct 2007 02:57:39
From: still me
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 19:46:11 -0500, Tom Sherman
<sunsetss0003@yahoo.com > wrote:
>Of course, it has been years since I have ridden significant distances
>(other that two (2) metric centuries) on tires less than 33-mm wide.
Whadaya drivin a truck ?
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Date: 18 Oct 2007 22:33:45
From: Tom Sherman
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
"still me" wrote:
> On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 19:46:11 -0500, Tom Sherman
> <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Of course, it has been years since I have ridden significant distances
>> (other that two (2) metric centuries) on tires less than 33-mm wide.
>
>
> Whadaya drivin a truck ?
No, just wheels of ISO 305-mm and ISO 406-mm size. Conventional "road
bike" wisdom does not apply, which has been my point all along in this
thread.
--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
Beer - It's not just for breakfast anymore!
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Date: 13 Oct 2007 15:01:24
From: smipypr@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
On Oct 11, 5:56 pm, "Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com"
<pe...@vecchios.com > wrote:
> On Oct 11, 3:18 pm, "Mike" <mik...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>
> > > Not dead, not even breathing shallowly...more tubies being made today
> > > than in the past decade...tubeless is gonna die on road bikes........
> > > nothing new at Interbike from any rim/wheel/tire maker. We have made
> > > more tubie wheelsets for people 'JRA' than ever.
>
> > How many of these customers are learning to install the tires themselves,
> > rather than bring them into the shop every time they flat? That's always
> > been the biggest issue for customers contemplating tubies. Until it's not a
> > messy process (although I don't have much trouble installing them without
> > making a mess, but I've had years of practice), I don't think they're
> > appropriate for most customers.
>
> Most glue their own after I teach them how..not hard with a can of
> glue and a little solvent brush.
>
> I don't think they are right for most, but for those that used to have
> them or want the advantages..we build them. trekspecializedgiant
> stores probably don't.
>
>
>
>
>
> > --Mike--
> > Chain Reaction Bicycleswww.ChainReaction.com
>
> > "Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com" <pe...@vecchios.com> wrote in
> > messagenews:1192131857.902894.187620@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > On Oct 11, 1:13 pm, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >> > Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
> > >> > these days...
>
> > >> >http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>
> > >> Excuse me? Sorry, but if there ain't no Clement Criterium Seta (or Seta
> > >> Extra if you had an extra-special event), there ain't no tubular worth
> > >> having. Period.
>
> > >> $14.99 back when I was racing, with the Seta Extra going for the
> > >> ridiculously-high price of $17.99. And then there were the guys on the
> > >> bleeding edge, using Clement #3s for crits.
>
> > >> Not too many decent alternatives back then. Wolbers wobbled... everyone
> > >> initially bought into all the hype about their "Invulnerable" but that
> > >> never
> > >> seemed to be the case for me. Canettis weren't too bad, when you could
> > >> find
> > >> them, although the tread seemed to wear out more quickly than the
> > >> Clements.
> > >> D'Alessandro was infamous for some really cheap tires people use for
> > >> spares.
> > >> Michelin had some weirdly-made cheapies, whose name I don't recall, that
> > >> couldn't be mounted straight no matter what, and didn't ride very well
> > >> either. Vittoria hadn't come out with anything decent yet; not until the
> > >> Vittoira CX was there much of an alternative to the Clement Criterium
> > >> Seta,
> > >> in my opinion.
>
> > >> For glue, I was a tubasti guy. I liked the fact that it never actually
> > >> dried, giving me the false impression that a tire installed in the field
> > >> wasn't going to roll off the rim.
>
> > >> For touring, those with $$$ used Clement DelMonsters, er, I mean, Del
> > >> Mundos. Heavier guys raced on Paris Roubaixs (probably what I'd have to
> > >> use
> > >> now).
>
> > >> --Mike Jacoubowsky
> > >> Chain Reaction Bicycleswww.ChainReaction.com
> > >> Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
>
> > >http://www.cyclingnews.com/tech.php?id=/photos/2007/tech/probikes/ogr...
>
> > > LOTS of tubies for lots of riding and racing..not included are some
> > > really decent $25 tubies from Conti and Vittoria..
>
> > > Not dead, not even breathing shallowly...more tubies being made today
> > > than in the past decade...tubeless is gonna die on road bikes........
> > > nothing new at Interbike from any rim/wheel/tire maker. We have made
> > > more tubie wheelsets for people 'JRA' than ever.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
I first tried tubies when Tufo came out with their gluing tape. I
discovered how tough the extreme tape is when I tried to remove the
tires to switch the Pave tires to a different set of wheels. I then
tried a method described on the cyclocrossworld.com website. They have
a brand of tape, and suggested using the tape, along with regular glue
on the ires. I got the tires on(the new set, Vittoria Corsa),
but...what a mess. Maybe it was the fumes, but mostly it was the
inexperience. I'd like to get the tires off, clean the wheels (and the
tire sidewalls), then remount the tires using just the Tufo extreme
tape. Would a household type steam cleaner be OK to soften the glue
and get the rims/spokes cleaned up? I've used naptha before, but it
seems the steam would soften the glue enough to use Scotchbrite pads
to clean the rims and spokes. I don't plan on using the steamer on the
tires - I'll take them off the hard way. Any suggestions?
Tom P.
ps - I know I'm a dumbass.
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Date: 14 Oct 2007 18:41:48
From: John Thompson
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
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On 2007-10-13, smipypr@yahoo.com <smipypr@yahoo.com > wrote:
> I got the tires on(the new set, Vittoria Corsa),
> but...what a mess. Maybe it was the fumes, but mostly it was the
> inexperience. I'd like to get the tires off, clean the wheels (and the
> tire sidewalls), then remount the tires using just the Tufo extreme
> tape. Would a household type steam cleaner be OK to soften the glue
> and get the rims/spokes cleaned up? I've used naptha before, but it
> seems the steam would soften the glue enough to use Scotchbrite pads
> to clean the rims and spokes. I don't plan on using the steamer on the
> tires - I'll take them off the hard way. Any suggestions?
I've taken to using a brass wire wheel.
Before: http://www.os2.dhs.org/~john/rim-before.jpg
After: http://www.os2.dhs.org/~john/rim-after.jpg
Here's the wheel I use: http://www.os2.dhs.org/~john/rim-cleaner.jpg
--
John (john@os2.dhs.org)
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Date: 15 Oct 2007 01:10:08
From: still me
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
On Sun, 14 Oct 2007 18:41:48 -0500, John Thompson
<john@vector.os2.dhs.org > wrote:
>I've taken to using a brass wire wheel.
>
>Before: http://www.os2.dhs.org/~john/rim-before.jpg
>
>After: http://www.os2.dhs.org/~john/rim-after.jpg
>
>Here's the wheel I use: http://www.os2.dhs.org/~john/rim-cleaner.jpg
I found the wheel good for hardened cement. If it's soft, it's a mixed
bag.
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Date: 14 Oct 2007 00:40:04
From: still me
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
On Sat, 13 Oct 2007 15:01:24 -0700, "smipypr@yahoo.com"
<smipypr@yahoo.com > wrote:
>I first tried tubies when Tufo came out with their gluing tape. I
>discovered how tough the extreme tape is when I tried to remove the
>tires to switch the Pave tires to a different set of wheels. I then
>tried a method described on the cyclocrossworld.com website. They have
>a brand of tape, and suggested using the tape, along with regular glue
>on the ires. I got the tires on(the new set, Vittoria Corsa),
>but...what a mess. Maybe it was the fumes, but mostly it was the
>inexperience. I'd like to get the tires off, clean the wheels (and the
>tire sidewalls), then remount the tires using just the Tufo extreme
>tape. Would a household type steam cleaner be OK to soften the glue
>and get the rims/spokes cleaned up? I've used naptha before, but it
>seems the steam would soften the glue enough to use Scotchbrite pads
>to clean the rims and spokes. I don't plan on using the steamer on the
>tires - I'll take them off the hard way. Any suggestions?
Whatever you can to remove the major stuff, then various solvents
until you find one that works. My solvent stand has alcohol, wood
alcohol, lacquer thinner, naptha, and acetone. One of them always
works :-)
Are you racing? If not, and you are good with the idea of tubie tape,
you might want to try the traditional Velox tubular type. It's not
nearly as overly sticky as the tufo tapes. You can remove a tire on
the road with relative ease and replace it with another. I've probably
horrified the pro's here by even mentioning it, but I've used it for
years and never rolled a tire. Then again, I don't race professionally
and I don't ride down mountains in the middle of Summer. YMMV.
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Date: 13 Oct 2007 20:36:05
From: A Muzi
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
> "smipypr@yahoo.com" <smipypr@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> I first tried tubies when Tufo came out with their gluing tape. I
>> discovered how tough the extreme tape is when I tried to remove the
>> tires to switch the Pave tires to a different set of wheels. I then
>> tried a method described on the cyclocrossworld.com website. They have
>> a brand of tape, and suggested using the tape, along with regular glue
>> on the ires. I got the tires on(the new set, Vittoria Corsa),
>> but...what a mess. Maybe it was the fumes, but mostly it was the
>> inexperience. I'd like to get the tires off, clean the wheels (and the
>> tire sidewalls), then remount the tires using just the Tufo extreme
>> tape. Would a household type steam cleaner be OK to soften the glue
>> and get the rims/spokes cleaned up? I've used naptha before, but it
>> seems the steam would soften the glue enough to use Scotchbrite pads
>> to clean the rims and spokes. I don't plan on using the steamer on the
>> tires - I'll take them off the hard way. Any suggestions?
still me wrote:
> Whatever you can to remove the major stuff, then various solvents
> until you find one that works. My solvent stand has alcohol, wood
> alcohol, lacquer thinner, naptha, and acetone. One of them always
> works :-)
>
> Are you racing? If not, and you are good with the idea of tubie tape,
> you might want to try the traditional Velox tubular type. It's not
> nearly as overly sticky as the tufo tapes. You can remove a tire on
> the road with relative ease and replace it with another. I've probably
> horrified the pro's here by even mentioning it, but I've used it for
> years and never rolled a tire. Then again, I don't race professionally
> and I don't ride down mountains in the middle of Summer. YMMV.
The older Velox Jantex was an open mesh cotton with a dark brown cement
(wrapped in tinfoil). The current product is white and very different,
not sure which you meant. Stop at your LBS and look at the new Jantex.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
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Date: 15 Oct 2007 01:12:26
From: still me
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
On Sat, 13 Oct 2007 20:36:05 -0500, A Muzi <am@yellowjersey.org >
wrote:
>The older Velox Jantex was an open mesh cotton with a dark brown cement
>(wrapped in tinfoil). The current product is white and very different,
>not sure which you meant. Stop at your LBS and look at the new Jantex.
Point acknowledged. I used to buy the sticky, smelly, brown stuff and
I liked it. The white was made by someone back then but I forget who.
The white is still less annoying than the tufo but I don't know that
it's as sticky. Time will tell.
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Date: 11 Oct 2007 19:26:52
From: Stephen Bauman
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
On Thu, 11 Oct 2007 19:13:24 +0000, Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
>
> For glue, I was a tubasti guy. I liked the fact that it never actually
> dried, giving me the false impression that a tire installed in the field
> wasn't going to roll off the rim.
>
Tubasti glue would melt in high temperature and loose its adhesion. If it
were in the 90's and you were braking going down a mountain, you could
count on rolling a tire. Clement Extra Mastice Gutta per Tubulari Strada
always held firm. Besides, that red-brown spot on the pinky was a badge
of honor.
> For touring, those with $$$ used Clement DelMonsters, er, I mean, Del
> Mundos. Heavier guys raced on Paris Roubaixs (probably what I'd have to
> use now).
Del Mondos were silks. The Speciale Corsa was the cotton version and was
a great tubular. They were for us tourists with only $$ who would also
tour in the rain.
Steve Bauman
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Date: 11 Oct 2007 15:56:39
From: Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
On Oct 11, 3:18 pm, "Mike" <mik...@ix.netcom.com > wrote:
> > Not dead, not even breathing shallowly...more tubies being made today
> > than in the past decade...tubeless is gonna die on road bikes........
> > nothing new at Interbike from any rim/wheel/tire maker. We have made
> > more tubie wheelsets for people 'JRA' than ever.
>
> How many of these customers are learning to install the tires themselves,
> rather than bring them into the shop every time they flat? That's always
> been the biggest issue for customers contemplating tubies. Until it's not a
> messy process (although I don't have much trouble installing them without
> making a mess, but I've had years of practice), I don't think they're
> appropriate for most customers.
Most glue their own after I teach them how..not hard with a can of
glue and a little solvent brush.
I don't think they are right for most, but for those that used to have
them or want the advantages..we build them. trekspecializedgiant
stores probably don't.
>
> --Mike--
> Chain Reaction Bicycleswww.ChainReaction.com
>
> "Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com" <pe...@vecchios.com> wrote in
> messagenews:1192131857.902894.187620@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...
>
> > On Oct 11, 1:13 pm, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com>
> > wrote:
> >> > Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
> >> > these days...
>
> >> >http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>
> >> Excuse me? Sorry, but if there ain't no Clement Criterium Seta (or Seta
> >> Extra if you had an extra-special event), there ain't no tubular worth
> >> having. Period.
>
> >> $14.99 back when I was racing, with the Seta Extra going for the
> >> ridiculously-high price of $17.99. And then there were the guys on the
> >> bleeding edge, using Clement #3s for crits.
>
> >> Not too many decent alternatives back then. Wolbers wobbled... everyone
> >> initially bought into all the hype about their "Invulnerable" but that
> >> never
> >> seemed to be the case for me. Canettis weren't too bad, when you could
> >> find
> >> them, although the tread seemed to wear out more quickly than the
> >> Clements.
> >> D'Alessandro was infamous for some really cheap tires people use for
> >> spares.
> >> Michelin had some weirdly-made cheapies, whose name I don't recall, that
> >> couldn't be mounted straight no matter what, and didn't ride very well
> >> either. Vittoria hadn't come out with anything decent yet; not until the
> >> Vittoira CX was there much of an alternative to the Clement Criterium
> >> Seta,
> >> in my opinion.
>
> >> For glue, I was a tubasti guy. I liked the fact that it never actually
> >> dried, giving me the false impression that a tire installed in the field
> >> wasn't going to roll off the rim.
>
> >> For touring, those with $$$ used Clement DelMonsters, er, I mean, Del
> >> Mundos. Heavier guys raced on Paris Roubaixs (probably what I'd have to
> >> use
> >> now).
>
> >> --Mike Jacoubowsky
> >> Chain Reaction Bicycleswww.ChainReaction.com
> >> Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
>
> >http://www.cyclingnews.com/tech.php?id=/photos/2007/tech/probikes/ogr...
>
> > LOTS of tubies for lots of riding and racing..not included are some
> > really decent $25 tubies from Conti and Vittoria..
>
> > Not dead, not even breathing shallowly...more tubies being made today
> > than in the past decade...tubeless is gonna die on road bikes........
> > nothing new at Interbike from any rim/wheel/tire maker. We have made
> > more tubie wheelsets for people 'JRA' than ever.
|
| |
Date: 11 Oct 2007 21:44:13
From: Tom Ace
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
On Oct 11, 12:13 pm, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com >
wrote:
> Michelin had some weirdly-made cheapies, whose name I don't recall, that
> couldn't be mounted straight no matter what, and didn't ride very well
> either.
Michelin Falco and Nibbio--cheap cotton tubulars.
(I had a few Clement silks that wouldn't mount straight either.)
Tom Ace
|
| |
Date: 11 Oct 2007 14:07:57
From:
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for an expensive PIA
|
On Oct 11, 11:28 am, "bfd" <bfd...@comcast.net > wrote:
> "Ozark Bicycle" <bicycleatel...@ozarkbicycleservice.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1192120209.630293.60830@d55g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>
> > On Oct 11, 11:19 am, "Tom Nakashima" <t...@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:
> >> "Ozark Bicycle" <bicycleatel...@ozarkbicycleservice.com> wrote in message
>
> >>news:1192118362.299378.20460@50g2000hsm.googlegroups.com...
>
> >> > On Oct 11, 10:41 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com"
> >> > <pe...@vecchios.com> wrote:
> >> >> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
> >> >> these days...
>
> >> >>http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>
> >> > Holy rolling feces, Batman, look at dem prices! Almost $50 for a *#
> >> > %^&#*^ Conti sprinter! That's f***ing insane! No wonder almost no one
> >> > uses the damn things anymore.
>
> >> I never thought the Conti sprinter was a good tire when it was priced
> >> @ $15.99.
>
> > Agreed, IMO, the Sprinter was a cheapie adequate for use as a pre-
> > glued spare, folded up in your tire sock. Nothing more.
>
> Has anyone tried the $20 or 3 for $50 Servizio Corsa tubular tires sold by
> Andy Muzi at Yellow Jersey:
>
> http://www.yellowjersey.org/tt.html
>
> Seems like a great deal!
I use Servizio Corsas exclusively on my high falutin' Master Extra
Light and I love 'em. Hard enough to last and soft enough to stick.
And straighter than any Conti or Vittoria Ralley I've ever glued on. I
don't endorse them for Andrew but I'll swear by them. Now, if he could
only get some Strada 66s...
tf
|
| |
Date: 11 Oct 2007 12:44:17
From: Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
On Oct 11, 1:13 pm, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com >
wrote:
> > Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
> > these days...
>
> >http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>
> Excuse me? Sorry, but if there ain't no Clement Criterium Seta (or Seta
> Extra if you had an extra-special event), there ain't no tubular worth
> having. Period.
>
> $14.99 back when I was racing, with the Seta Extra going for the
> ridiculously-high price of $17.99. And then there were the guys on the
> bleeding edge, using Clement #3s for crits.
>
> Not too many decent alternatives back then. Wolbers wobbled... everyone
> initially bought into all the hype about their "Invulnerable" but that never
> seemed to be the case for me. Canettis weren't too bad, when you could find
> them, although the tread seemed to wear out more quickly than the Clements.
> D'Alessandro was infamous for some really cheap tires people use for spares.
> Michelin had some weirdly-made cheapies, whose name I don't recall, that
> couldn't be mounted straight no matter what, and didn't ride very well
> either. Vittoria hadn't come out with anything decent yet; not until the
> Vittoira CX was there much of an alternative to the Clement Criterium Seta,
> in my opinion.
>
> For glue, I was a tubasti guy. I liked the fact that it never actually
> dried, giving me the false impression that a tire installed in the field
> wasn't going to roll off the rim.
>
> For touring, those with $$$ used Clement DelMonsters, er, I mean, Del
> Mundos. Heavier guys raced on Paris Roubaixs (probably what I'd have to use
> now).
>
> --Mike Jacoubowsky
> Chain Reaction Bicycleswww.ChainReaction.com
> Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
http://www.cyclingnews.com/tech.php?id=/photos/2007/tech/probikes/ogrady_paris_roubaix/Stuart_OGradys_Team_CSC_Cervelo_R3_PR_tires
LOTS of tubies for lots of riding and racing..not included are some
really decent $25 tubies from Conti and Vittoria..
Not dead, not even breathing shallowly...more tubies being made today
than in the past decade...tubeless is gonna die on road bikes........
nothing new at Interbike from any rim/wheel/tire maker. We have made
more tubie wheelsets for people 'JRA' than ever.
|
| | |
Date: 11 Oct 2007 21:18:59
From: Mike
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
> Not dead, not even breathing shallowly...more tubies being made today
> than in the past decade...tubeless is gonna die on road bikes........
> nothing new at Interbike from any rim/wheel/tire maker. We have made
> more tubie wheelsets for people 'JRA' than ever.
How many of these customers are learning to install the tires themselves,
rather than bring them into the shop every time they flat? That's always
been the biggest issue for customers contemplating tubies. Until it's not a
messy process (although I don't have much trouble installing them without
making a mess, but I've had years of practice), I don't think they're
appropriate for most customers.
--Mike--
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
"Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com" <peter@vecchios.com > wrote in
message news:1192131857.902894.187620@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 11, 1:13 pm, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com>
> wrote:
>> > Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
>> > these days...
>>
>> >http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>>
>> Excuse me? Sorry, but if there ain't no Clement Criterium Seta (or Seta
>> Extra if you had an extra-special event), there ain't no tubular worth
>> having. Period.
>>
>> $14.99 back when I was racing, with the Seta Extra going for the
>> ridiculously-high price of $17.99. And then there were the guys on the
>> bleeding edge, using Clement #3s for crits.
>>
>> Not too many decent alternatives back then. Wolbers wobbled... everyone
>> initially bought into all the hype about their "Invulnerable" but that
>> never
>> seemed to be the case for me. Canettis weren't too bad, when you could
>> find
>> them, although the tread seemed to wear out more quickly than the
>> Clements.
>> D'Alessandro was infamous for some really cheap tires people use for
>> spares.
>> Michelin had some weirdly-made cheapies, whose name I don't recall, that
>> couldn't be mounted straight no matter what, and didn't ride very well
>> either. Vittoria hadn't come out with anything decent yet; not until the
>> Vittoira CX was there much of an alternative to the Clement Criterium
>> Seta,
>> in my opinion.
>>
>> For glue, I was a tubasti guy. I liked the fact that it never actually
>> dried, giving me the false impression that a tire installed in the field
>> wasn't going to roll off the rim.
>>
>> For touring, those with $$$ used Clement DelMonsters, er, I mean, Del
>> Mundos. Heavier guys raced on Paris Roubaixs (probably what I'd have to
>> use
>> now).
>>
>> --Mike Jacoubowsky
>> Chain Reaction Bicycleswww.ChainReaction.com
>> Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
>
> http://www.cyclingnews.com/tech.php?id=/photos/2007/tech/probikes/ogrady_paris_roubaix/Stuart_OGradys_Team_CSC_Cervelo_R3_PR_tires
>
> LOTS of tubies for lots of riding and racing..not included are some
> really decent $25 tubies from Conti and Vittoria..
>
> Not dead, not even breathing shallowly...more tubies being made today
> than in the past decade...tubeless is gonna die on road bikes........
> nothing new at Interbike from any rim/wheel/tire maker. We have made
> more tubie wheelsets for people 'JRA' than ever.
>
|
| | |
Date: 11 Oct 2007 14:29:28
From:
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
On Thu, 11 Oct 2007 12:44:17 -0700, "Qui si parla
Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com" <peter@vecchios.com > wrote:
>On Oct 11, 1:13 pm, "Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com>
>wrote:
>> > Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
>> > these days...
>>
>> >http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>>
>> Excuse me? Sorry, but if there ain't no Clement Criterium Seta (or Seta
>> Extra if you had an extra-special event), there ain't no tubular worth
>> having. Period.
>>
>> $14.99 back when I was racing, with the Seta Extra going for the
>> ridiculously-high price of $17.99. And then there were the guys on the
>> bleeding edge, using Clement #3s for crits.
>>
>> Not too many decent alternatives back then. Wolbers wobbled... everyone
>> initially bought into all the hype about their "Invulnerable" but that never
>> seemed to be the case for me. Canettis weren't too bad, when you could find
>> them, although the tread seemed to wear out more quickly than the Clements.
>> D'Alessandro was infamous for some really cheap tires people use for spares.
>> Michelin had some weirdly-made cheapies, whose name I don't recall, that
>> couldn't be mounted straight no matter what, and didn't ride very well
>> either. Vittoria hadn't come out with anything decent yet; not until the
>> Vittoira CX was there much of an alternative to the Clement Criterium Seta,
>> in my opinion.
>>
>> For glue, I was a tubasti guy. I liked the fact that it never actually
>> dried, giving me the false impression that a tire installed in the field
>> wasn't going to roll off the rim.
>>
>> For touring, those with $$$ used Clement DelMonsters, er, I mean, Del
>> Mundos. Heavier guys raced on Paris Roubaixs (probably what I'd have to use
>> now).
>>
>> --Mike Jacoubowsky
>> Chain Reaction Bicycleswww.ChainReaction.com
>> Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
>
>http://www.cyclingnews.com/tech.php?id=/photos/2007/tech/probikes/ogrady_paris_roubaix/Stuart_OGradys_Team_CSC_Cervelo_R3_PR_tires
>
>LOTS of tubies for lots of riding and racing..not included are some
>really decent $25 tubies from Conti and Vittoria..
>
>Not dead, not even breathing shallowly...more tubies being made today
>than in the past decade...tubeless is gonna die on road bikes........
>nothing new at Interbike from any rim/wheel/tire maker. We have made
>more tubie wheelsets for people 'JRA' than ever.
Dear Peter,
I, for one, welcome our new glue-smeared overlords and look forward to
seeing swarms of fixed-gear recumbents rolling on tubulars next
spring!
:-)
Cheers,
Carl Fogel
|
| |
Date: 11 Oct 2007 19:13:24
From: Mike Jacoubowsky
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
> these days...
>
> http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
Excuse me? Sorry, but if there ain't no Clement Criterium Seta (or Seta
Extra if you had an extra-special event), there ain't no tubular worth
having. Period.
$14.99 back when I was racing, with the Seta Extra going for the
ridiculously-high price of $17.99. And then there were the guys on the
bleeding edge, using Clement #3s for crits.
Not too many decent alternatives back then. Wolbers wobbled... everyone
initially bought into all the hype about their "Invulnerable" but that never
seemed to be the case for me. Canettis weren't too bad, when you could find
them, although the tread seemed to wear out more quickly than the Clements.
D'Alessandro was infamous for some really cheap tires people use for spares.
Michelin had some weirdly-made cheapies, whose name I don't recall, that
couldn't be mounted straight no matter what, and didn't ride very well
either. Vittoria hadn't come out with anything decent yet; not until the
Vittoira CX was there much of an alternative to the Clement Criterium Seta,
in my opinion.
For glue, I was a tubasti guy. I liked the fact that it never actually
dried, giving me the false impression that a tire installed in the field
wasn't going to roll off the rim.
For touring, those with $$$ used Clement DelMonsters, er, I mean, Del
Mundos. Heavier guys raced on Paris Roubaixs (probably what I'd have to use
now).
--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
|
| | |
Date: 11 Oct 2007 20:07:32
From: David L. Johnson
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
> Excuse me? Sorry, but if there ain't no Clement Criterium Seta (or Seta
> Extra if you had an extra-special event), there ain't no tubular worth
> having. Period.
Amen.
>
> $14.99 back when I was racing, with the Seta Extra going for the
> ridiculously-high price of $17.99. And then there were the guys on the
> bleeding edge, using Clement #3s for crits.
The Clement #3 was an excellent track tire. It seemed to last forever,
and of course weighed essentially nothing.
>
> Not too many decent alternatives back then. Wolbers wobbled... everyone
> initially bought into all the hype about their "Invulnerable" but that never
> seemed to be the case for me.
Wolbers were terrible tires.
> For touring, those with $$$ used Clement DelMonsters, er, I mean, Del
> Mundos.
Those were also incredible tires.
--
David L. Johnson
When you are up to your ass in alligators, it's hard to remember that
your initial objective was to drain the swamp.
-- LBJ
|
| | | |
Date: 12 Oct 2007 17:16:32
From: still me
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
On Thu, 11 Oct 2007 20:07:32 -0400, "David L. Johnson"
<david.johnson@lehigh.edu > wrote:
>> Not too many decent alternatives back then. Wolbers wobbled... everyone
>> initially bought into all the hype about their "Invulnerable" but that never
>> seemed to be the case for me.
>
>Wolbers were terrible tires.
I used mostly cheap Hutchinsons, Clements, Wolbers, etc. Whenever I
bought an expensive set of tubies they always flatted soon after - the
cheap ones always seemed to last much, much longer before I was back
in the sewing room.
I also shun latex tubes, and butyl was always easily available in the
low to mid tires.
|
| | |
Date: 11 Oct 2007 17:25:46
From: A Muzi
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
>> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
>> these days...
>> http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
> Excuse me? Sorry, but if there ain't no Clement Criterium Seta (or Seta
> Extra if you had an extra-special event), there ain't no tubular worth
> having. Period.
>
> $14.99 back when I was racing, with the Seta Extra going for the
> ridiculously-high price of $17.99. And then there were the guys on the
> bleeding edge, using Clement #3s for crits.
>
> Not too many decent alternatives back then. Wolbers wobbled... everyone
> initially bought into all the hype about their "Invulnerable" but that never
> seemed to be the case for me. Canettis weren't too bad, when you could find
> them, although the tread seemed to wear out more quickly than the Clements.
> D'Alessandro was infamous for some really cheap tires people use for spares.
> Michelin had some weirdly-made cheapies, whose name I don't recall, that
> couldn't be mounted straight no matter what, and didn't ride very well
> either. Vittoria hadn't come out with anything decent yet; not until the
> Vittoira CX was there much of an alternative to the Clement Criterium Seta,
> in my opinion.
>
> For glue, I was a tubasti guy. I liked the fact that it never actually
> dried, giving me the false impression that a tire installed in the field
> wasn't going to roll off the rim.
>
> For touring, those with $$$ used Clement DelMonsters, er, I mean, Del
> Mundos. Heavier guys raced on Paris Roubaixs (probably what I'd have to use
> now).
Italian Clements were indeed well made*. Some of their 'mystique' may be
just from being part of our halcyon youth, taking nothing from the
reality of their quality. Reports of 'perfection' may be exaggerated. (a
new white-tread Clement #1 with open silk sides shimmering in sunlight
sure is close)
d'Alessandro lost both his eponymous company and Atalanta Gomma in
divorces, later founded d'Alecy which backed US Tubular. His top range
tires were excellent in the first two ventures, not so much in the
latter. Ever ride d'Alessandro Imperforabile Setas? Nice.
Michelin never made much commitment to their acquired Wolber tubular
operation. I think the whacky name you're looking for is 'Nibbio'. We
imported the Spanish-made heavy Michelin tubulars (known here as
'Michelli'). Like a hybrid tire sewn together on the bottom. Odd beast.
Pre-Michelin, Wolber offered premium handmade models. They were as well
built as Dourdoigne or Clement or anyone. But the volume was always at
the bottom where they slugged it out against Clement's awful Elvezios
for the cheap tire of the moment.
If anyone excelled at that, it was Barum. Great tire, extremely long
tread life and half the cost of anyone else. Then the Wall came down...
*Italian hand labor is no longer cheap. In our youth, Italy was a poor
country, not so today. Italian machinery with skilled Thai labor is a
good combination IMHO.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
|
| | | |
Date: 12 Oct 2007 15:21:42
From: Michael Press
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
In article <13gt8kt35ok2683@corp.supernews.com >,
A Muzi <am@yellowjersey.org > wrote:
> >> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
> >> these days...
> >> http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>
> Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
> > Excuse me? Sorry, but if there ain't no Clement Criterium Seta (or Seta
> > Extra if you had an extra-special event), there ain't no tubular worth
> > having. Period.
> >
> > $14.99 back when I was racing, with the Seta Extra going for the
> > ridiculously-high price of $17.99. And then there were the guys on the
> > bleeding edge, using Clement #3s for crits.
> >
> > Not too many decent alternatives back then. Wolbers wobbled... everyone
> > initially bought into all the hype about their "Invulnerable" but that never
> > seemed to be the case for me. Canettis weren't too bad, when you could find
> > them, although the tread seemed to wear out more quickly than the Clements.
> > D'Alessandro was infamous for some really cheap tires people use for spares.
> > Michelin had some weirdly-made cheapies, whose name I don't recall, that
> > couldn't be mounted straight no matter what, and didn't ride very well
> > either. Vittoria hadn't come out with anything decent yet; not until the
> > Vittoira CX was there much of an alternative to the Clement Criterium Seta,
> > in my opinion.
> >
> > For glue, I was a tubasti guy. I liked the fact that it never actually
> > dried, giving me the false impression that a tire installed in the field
> > wasn't going to roll off the rim.
> >
> > For touring, those with $$$ used Clement DelMonsters, er, I mean, Del
> > Mundos. Heavier guys raced on Paris Roubaixs (probably what I'd have to use
> > now).
>
> Italian Clements were indeed well made*. Some of their 'mystique' may be
> just from being part of our halcyon youth, taking nothing from the
> reality of their quality. Reports of 'perfection' may be exaggerated. (a
> new white-tread Clement #1 with open silk sides shimmering in sunlight
> sure is close)
>
> d'Alessandro lost both his eponymous company and Atalanta Gomma in
> divorces, later founded d'Alecy which backed US Tubular. His top range
> tires were excellent in the first two ventures, not so much in the
> latter. Ever ride d'Alessandro Imperforabile Setas? Nice.
>
> Michelin never made much commitment to their acquired Wolber tubular
> operation. I think the whacky name you're looking for is 'Nibbio'. We
> imported the Spanish-made heavy Michelin tubulars (known here as
> 'Michelli'). Like a hybrid tire sewn together on the bottom. Odd beast.
>
> Pre-Michelin, Wolber offered premium handmade models. They were as well
> built as Dourdoigne or Clement or anyone. But the volume was always at
> the bottom where they slugged it out against Clement's awful Elvezios
> for the cheap tire of the moment.
I think that is `Elvezia'. They were a byword for `pig of a tire'.
Probably a much better tire today, were the available.
The good thing about them is that you could ride them flat
and not notice the difference.
--
Michael Press
|
| |
Date: 11 Oct 2007 17:23:31
From: Sheldon Brown
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for an expensive PIA
|
Quoth Tom Nakashima:
> I haven't ridden sew-ups for quite a while now, but nothing felt as good
> as a worn-in Clement Criterium Seta Silk Tubular. I recall the price about
> $27.oo back then. .Hate to see the price if they remade those today.
Yes, those were sweet! I used to get 'em wholesale at $11 a pop.
They spoiled me for lesser-quality tubulars, I'm afraid.
Sheldon "Clinchers Now" Brown
+-----------------------------------------------------------+
|
| |
Date: 11 Oct 2007 12:12:00
From: A Muzi
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com wrote:
> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
> these days...
> http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
Yikes! I noticed a big void where the $20 tire section s'posa be!
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
|
| | |
Date: 13 Oct 2007 17:50:23
From: Tom Sherman
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
Andrew Muzi mused:
> Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com wrote:
>> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
>> these days...
>> http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>
> Yikes! I noticed a big void where the $20 tire section s'posa be!
They list the "Paris Roubaix Silk" as a "Great tire for touring". At
$210.50 each, with a few spares (who wants to fix tubulars while on a
tour), the tires will cost more than the bicycle. Sheesh!
Sillier than brifters on a touring bicycle.
--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
Beer - It's not just for breakfast anymore!
|
| | | |
Date: 13 Oct 2007 20:29:33
From: A Muzi
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
>> Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com wrote:
>>> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
>>> these days...
>>> http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
> Andrew Muzi mused:
>> Yikes! I noticed a big void where the $20 tire section s'posa be!
Tom Sherman wrote:
> They list the "Paris Roubaix Silk" as a "Great tire for touring". At
> $210.50 each, with a few spares (who wants to fix tubulars while on a
> tour), the tires will cost more than the bicycle. Sheesh!
> Sillier than brifters on a touring bicycle.
Uhh, that particular item is not out of line. If you can find a handmade
silk at all now.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
|
| | | | |
Date: 13 Oct 2007 20:40:38
From: Tom Sherman
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
Andrew Muzi mused:
>>> Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com wrote:
>>>> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
>>>> these days...
>>>> http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>
>> Andrew Muzi mused:
>>> Yikes! I noticed a big void where the $20 tire section s'posa be!
>
> Tom Sherman wrote:
>> They list the "Paris Roubaix Silk" as a "Great tire for touring". At
>> $210.50 each, with a few spares (who wants to fix tubulars while on a
>> tour), the tires will cost more than the bicycle. Sheesh!
>> Sillier than brifters on a touring bicycle.
>
> Uhh, that particular item is not out of line. If you can find a handmade
> silk at all now.
What real advantage will spending $421 do for the TOURING cyclist that
$60 for a pair of high quality clinchers would not? Would any of the
(alleged) advantages of tubulars apply to a loaded touring bicycle?
Would you want to descend a mountain pass on a loaded touring bike with
a field replaced tubular?
--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
Beer - It's not just for breakfast anymore!
|
| | | | | |
Date: 13 Oct 2007 19:16:21
From: Ted Bennett
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com > wrote:
> Andrew Muzi mused:
> >>> Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com wrote:
> >>>> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
> >>>> these days...
> >>>> http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
> >
> >> Andrew Muzi mused:
> >>> Yikes! I noticed a big void where the $20 tire section s'posa be!
> >
> > Tom Sherman wrote:
> >> They list the "Paris Roubaix Silk" as a "Great tire for touring". At
> >> $210.50 each, with a few spares (who wants to fix tubulars while on a
> >> tour), the tires will cost more than the bicycle. Sheesh!
> >> Sillier than brifters on a touring bicycle.
> >
> > Uhh, that particular item is not out of line. If you can find a handmade
> > silk at all now.
>
> What real advantage will spending $421 do for the TOURING cyclist that
> $60 for a pair of high quality clinchers would not? Would any of the
> (alleged) advantages of tubulars apply to a loaded touring bicycle?
> Would you want to descend a mountain pass on a loaded touring bike with
> a field replaced tubular?
Now you're channeling Jobst, who is also a great poo-poo-er of tubies.
The reduced chance of a pinch flat is one argument in favor.
> Would you want to descend a mountain pass on a loaded touring bike with
> a field replaced tubular?
Non, bien sur. That's the dealbreaker for me in that application.
Hey, that reminds me. Where's Sandy, our resident French lawyer?
--
Ted Bennett
|
| | | | | | |
Date: 14 Oct 2007 13:56:45
From: Sandy
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
Dans le message de
news:tedbennett-BC8E3D.19162113102007@earthlink.vsrv-sjc.supernews.net,
Ted Bennett <tedbennett@earthlink.net > a réfléchi, et puis a déclaré :
> Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Andrew Muzi mused:
>>>>> Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com wrote:
>>>>>> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and
>>>>>> well these days...
>>>>>> http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>>>
>>>> Andrew Muzi mused:
>>>>> Yikes! I noticed a big void where the $20 tire section s'posa be!
>>>
>>> Tom Sherman wrote:
>>>> They list the "Paris Roubaix Silk" as a "Great tire for touring".
>>>> At $210.50 each, with a few spares (who wants to fix tubulars
>>>> while on a tour), the tires will cost more than the bicycle.
>>>> Sheesh!
>>>> Sillier than brifters on a touring bicycle.
>>>
>>> Uhh, that particular item is not out of line. If you can find a
>>> handmade silk at all now.
>>
>> What real advantage will spending $421 do for the TOURING cyclist
>> that $60 for a pair of high quality clinchers would not? Would any
>> of the (alleged) advantages of tubulars apply to a loaded touring
>> bicycle? Would you want to descend a mountain pass on a loaded
>> touring bike with a field replaced tubular?
>
> Now you're channeling Jobst, who is also a great poo-poo-er of tubies.
>
> The reduced chance of a pinch flat is one argument in favor.
>
>> Would you want to descend a mountain pass on a loaded touring bike
>> with a field replaced tubular?
>
> Non, bien sur. That's the dealbreaker for me in that application.
> Hey, that reminds me. Where's Sandy, our resident French lawyer?
Funny how you got that right!
Resident - yes, of USA.
Lawyer - also true.
Hiding out on the oceanfront of Maine, currently.
Ocean winds are wicked.
--
Sandy
The above is guaranteed 100% free of sarcasm,
denigration, snotty remarks, indifference, platitudes, fuming demands that
"you do the math", conceited visions of a better world on wheels according
to [insert NAME here].
|
| | | | | | | |
Date: 15 Oct 2007 01:16:39
From: still me
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
On Sun, 14 Oct 2007 13:56:45 -0400, "Sandy" <leurrre@free.fr > wrote:
>Funny how you got that right!
>Resident - yes, of USA.
>Lawyer - also true.
>Hiding out on the oceanfront of Maine, currently.
>Ocean winds are wicked.
Better be careful with that "lawyer in Maine" talk. Might get you
steamed along with the lobsters. Ayup.
FYI - this time of year, the ocean winds only get colder. Good Luck
with that.
|
| | | | | | |
Date: 14 Oct 2007 00:39:17
From: Michael Press
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
In article
<tedbennett-BC8E3D.19162113102007@earthlink.vsrv-sjc.su
pernews.net >,
Ted Bennett <tedbennett@earthlink.net > wrote:
> Non, bien sur. That's the dealbreaker for me in that application.
> Hey, that reminds me. Where's Sandy, our resident French lawyer?
He has hinted that he wants to shift from law to cookery.
Also had a medical procedure scheduled for his eye.
--
Michael Press
|
| | | | | | | |
Date: 14 Oct 2007 12:11:00
From: Ted Bennett
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
|
Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net > wrote:
> Ted Bennett <tedbennett@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> > Non, bien sur. That's the dealbreaker for me in that application.
> > Hey, that reminds me. Where's Sandy, our resident French lawyer?
>
> He has hinted that he wants to shift from law to cookery.
> Also had a medical procedure scheduled for his eye.
That is of interest to me, professionally.
Sandy, do you care to reveal any details?
Ted
--
Ted Bennett
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Date: 14 Oct 2007 15:45:08
From: Sandy
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
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Dans le message de
news:tedbennett-191D1A.12105914102007@earthlink.vsrv-sjc.supernews.net,
Ted Bennett <tedbennett@earthlink.net > a réfléchi, et puis a déclaré :
> Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> wrote:
>
>> Ted Bennett <tedbennett@earthlink.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Non, bien sur. That's the dealbreaker for me in that application.
>>> Hey, that reminds me. Where's Sandy, our resident French lawyer?
>>
>> He has hinted that he wants to shift from law to cookery.
>> Also had a medical procedure scheduled for his eye.
>
> That is of interest to me, professionally.
>
> Sandy, do you care to reveal any details?
>
> Ted
Sure
Finding food that is edible is a tough road. Almost everything is
pre-processed. I looked in the rice aisle at a couple of supermarkets.
While in France, one has choices of many types, not to mention brands, of
rice, here the choices of plain food are very few, while the ones with added
flavors, ready-to-serve, are vast.
Wine is abominable to look for. Prices for imports are about 4-5 times
European prices, and I tried a couple of nonEuro wines at relatively high
prices, and they don't serve even for cooking.
But seafood here is abundant and fresh. I can't figure out why there isn't
any aquaculture going on. No oysters, clams, mussels, it seems, unless
found wild.
Group riding is interesting. While I am used to a leisurely 30-40 minute
warm-up, the down-to-business attitude here is 10 minutes and blast-off.
Tire prices - good thing I found a bunch of cheap deals in Europe. Here
they would be scandalously lowball.
Can't yet figure out whether bearnaise is good for rubber.
--
Sandy
--
C'est le contraire du vélo, la bicyclette.
Une silhouette profilée mauve fluo dévale
à soixante-dix à l'heure : c'est du vélo.
Deux lycéennes côte à côte traversent
un pont à Bruges : c'est de la bicyclette.
-Delerm, P.
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Date: 14 Oct 2007 15:48:58
From: Tim McNamara
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
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In article <471271c5$0$26420$4c368faf@roadrunner.com >,
"Sandy" <leurrre@free.fr > wrote:
> Dans le message de
> news:tedbennett-191D1A.12105914102007@earthlink.vsrv-sjc.supernews.net
> , Ted Bennett <tedbennett@earthlink.net> a réfléchi, et puis a
> déclaré :
> > Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> wrote:
> >
> >> Ted Bennett <tedbennett@earthlink.net> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Non, bien sur. That's the dealbreaker for me in that
> >>> application. Hey, that reminds me. Where's Sandy, our resident
> >>> French lawyer?
> >>
> >> He has hinted that he wants to shift from law to cookery. Also had
> >> a medical procedure scheduled for his eye.
> >
> > That is of interest to me, professionally.
> >
> > Sandy, do you care to reveal any details?
>
> Sure
>
> Finding food that is edible is a tough road. Almost everything is
> pre-processed. I looked in the rice aisle at a couple of
> supermarkets. While in France, one has choices of many types, not to
> mention brands, of rice, here the choices of plain food are very few,
> while the ones with added flavors, ready-to-serve, are vast.
Bummer. I have at least a dozen types of rice to choose from at the
natural foods cooperative where I shop. Long grain, short grain,
arborio, jasmine, basmati, sticky rice, "black" rice, brown rices,
organic versus conventional, etc. And a wonderful selections of fruits
and vegetables with an emphasis on seasonal locally-grown produce,
locally produced organic free-range meats and poultry and grass-fed beef
products.
In another post you mentioned you are in Maine. My advice is to get
acquainted natural foods store/cooperative if there is one in your area.
Plain foods, whole foods, unmessed-with foods are more readily available
there. I've never been to Maine which is a big state, but the Web
offers a few possibilities:
http://www.coopdirectory.org/directory.htm#Maine
http://www.crownofmainecoop.com/retailers.asp
If you're going to be there long term, it might be worthwhile to join a
CSA:
http://www.getrealgetmaine.com/buy/csa_farms.html
The "Edible Coastal Maine" magazine might be helpful in finding some
resources.
http://www.ediblecoastalmaine.com/
> Wine is abominable to look for. Prices for imports are about 4-5
> times European prices, and I tried a couple of nonEuro wines at
> relatively high prices, and they don't serve even for cooking.
When in France I found that the 3 Euro bottle of vin ordinaire was as
good or better than $8-10 bottles here in the US. Don't even get me
started on American wines, as most taste like alcoholic grape juice with
oak flavor added. There are some exceptions, but by and large I buy
French wines (Cotes du Rhones being my favorites). OTOH the
availability of good beer has improved dramatically in the US.
> But seafood here is abundant and fresh. I can't figure out why there
> isn't any aquaculture going on. No oysters, clams, mussels, it
> seems, unless found wild.
You're currently in Maine? Excellent quality seafood is easy to get
there.
> Group riding is interesting. While I am used to a leisurely 30-40
> minute warm-up, the down-to-business attitude here is 10 minutes and
> blast-off.
>
> Tire prices - good thing I found a bunch of cheap deals in Europe.
> Here they would be scandalously lowball.
I bought a 700 x 28 Michelin Tracer on the Col de Vars for $12 ($1 = 1
Euro on those halcyon days). At the time I think the going price here
was $20.
> Can't yet figure out whether bearnaise is good for rubber.
If filleted and presented rare.
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Date: 13 Oct 2007 21:37:31
From: Tom Sherman
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
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Ted Bennett wrote:
> Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Andrew Muzi mused:
>>>>> Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com wrote:
>>>>>> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
>>>>>> these days...
>>>>>> http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>>>> Andrew Muzi mused:
>>>>> Yikes! I noticed a big void where the $20 tire section s'posa be!
>>> Tom Sherman wrote:
>>>> They list the "Paris Roubaix Silk" as a "Great tire for touring". At
>>>> $210.50 each, with a few spares (who wants to fix tubulars while on a
>>>> tour), the tires will cost more than the bicycle. Sheesh!
>>>> Sillier than brifters on a touring bicycle.
>>> Uhh, that particular item is not out of line. If you can find a handmade
>>> silk at all now.
>> What real advantage will spending $421 do for the TOURING cyclist that
>> $60 for a pair of high quality clinchers would not? Would any of the
>> (alleged) advantages of tubulars apply to a loaded touring bicycle?
>> Would you want to descend a mountain pass on a loaded touring bike with
>> a field replaced tubular?
>
> Now you're channeling Jobst, who is also a great poo-poo-er of tubies.
>
> The reduced chance of a pinch flat is one argument in favor.
Even if this is true (Jobst writes otherwise), it would be a risk I
would take for ~$360, which buys a lot of tube patches and replacement
tubes.
Of course, my personal experience suggests that pinch flats are a myth,
punctures are rare, but flats from tubes tearing and valves leaking are
not uncommon (relatively speaking).
>> Would you want to descend a mountain pass on a loaded touring bike with
>> a field replaced tubular?
>
> Non, bien sur. That's the dealbreaker for me in that application....
I would not enjoy the ride if I had reason to believe that the tire was
less than optimally attached to the rim. This for me would outweigh the
touted "tubular benefits".
--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
Beer - It's not just for breakfast anymore!
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Date: 13 Oct 2007 21:51:43
From: David L. Johnson
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for info
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Tom Sherman wrote:
> What real advantage will spending $421 do for the TOURING cyclist that
> $60 for a pair of high quality clinchers would not? Would any of the
> (alleged) advantages of tubulars apply to a loaded touring bicycle?
> Would you want to descend a mountain pass on a loaded touring bike with
> a field replaced tubular?
>
Obviously --- or obviously to any but the faithful true believers, the
answer to this is that there is no advantage to touring on a tubular.
There are also huge disadvantages. Like trying to fix flats at night
when you should be sleeping. I did this once, touring with tubulars.
Frickin' stupid. I literally fell asleep one night with the sewing kit
in my hands, trying to fix a flat that had happened that day.
In addition, I found that riding with panniers greatly decreased the
heat dissipation from the rear wheel when braking. One long downhill
and I melted the glue on the rear tire.
But then, the faithful will ignore me because I also see no advantage
that a tubular gives to any rider. I, like many long-time riders,
resisted getting clinchers because I thought the feel of the bike would
suffer. But, by the time I switched, two things had happened. The
quality of sub-$100 tubulars had tanked, and the quality of
reasonably-priced clinchers had vastly increased. That is even more
true now.
--
David L. Johnson
Deserves death! I daresay he does. Many that live deserve death.
And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not
be too eager to deal out death in judgement.
-- J. R. R. Tolkein
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Date: 11 Oct 2007 09:31:10
From: Ozark Bicycle
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for an expensive PIA
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On Oct 11, 11:08 am, landotter <landot...@gmail.com > wrote:
> On Oct 11, 10:59 am, Ozark Bicycle
>
> <bicycleatel...@ozarkbicycleservice.com> wrote:
> > On Oct 11, 10:41 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com"
>
> > <pe...@vecchios.com> wrote:
> > > Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
> > > these days...
>
> > >http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>
> > Holy rolling feces, Batman, look at dem prices! Almost $50 for a *#
> > %^&#*^ Conti sprinter! That's f***ing insane! No wonder almost no one
> > uses the damn things anymore.
>
> $50 is a bargain--each example has uniqueness!
Yep, each one wobbles on the rim in it's own unique way!
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Date: 11 Oct 2007 09:30:09
From: Ozark Bicycle
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for an expensive PIA
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On Oct 11, 11:19 am, "Tom Nakashima" <t...@slac.stanford.edu > wrote:
> "Ozark Bicycle" <bicycleatel...@ozarkbicycleservice.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1192118362.299378.20460@50g2000hsm.googlegroups.com...
>
> > On Oct 11, 10:41 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com"
> > <pe...@vecchios.com> wrote:
> >> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
> >> these days...
>
> >>http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>
> > Holy rolling feces, Batman, look at dem prices! Almost $50 for a *#
> > %^&#*^ Conti sprinter! That's f***ing insane! No wonder almost no one
> > uses the damn things anymore.
>
> I never thought the Conti sprinter was a good tire when it was priced
> @ $15.99.
Agreed, IMO, the Sprinter was a cheapie adequate for use as a pre-
glued spare, folded up in your tire sock. Nothing more.
>
> I haven't ridden sew-ups for quite a while now, but nothing felt as good
> as a worn-in Clement Criterium Seta Silk Tubular. I recall the price about
> $27.oo back then. .Hate to see the price if they remade those today.
> -tom
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Date: 11 Oct 2007 10:28:01
From: bfd
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for an expensive PIA
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"Ozark Bicycle" <bicycleatelier@ozarkbicycleservice.com > wrote in message
news:1192120209.630293.60830@d55g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 11, 11:19 am, "Tom Nakashima" <t...@slac.stanford.edu> wrote:
>> "Ozark Bicycle" <bicycleatel...@ozarkbicycleservice.com> wrote in message
>>
>> news:1192118362.299378.20460@50g2000hsm.googlegroups.com...
>>
>> > On Oct 11, 10:41 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com"
>> > <pe...@vecchios.com> wrote:
>> >> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
>> >> these days...
>>
>> >>http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>>
>> > Holy rolling feces, Batman, look at dem prices! Almost $50 for a *#
>> > %^&#*^ Conti sprinter! That's f***ing insane! No wonder almost no one
>> > uses the damn things anymore.
>>
>> I never thought the Conti sprinter was a good tire when it was priced
>> @ $15.99.
>
>
> Agreed, IMO, the Sprinter was a cheapie adequate for use as a pre-
> glued spare, folded up in your tire sock. Nothing more.
>
Has anyone tried the $20 or 3 for $50 Servizio Corsa tubular tires sold by
Andy Muzi at Yellow Jersey:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/tt.html
Seems like a great deal!
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Date: 11 Oct 2007 09:08:00
From: landotter
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for an expensive PIA
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On Oct 11, 10:59 am, Ozark Bicycle
<bicycleatel...@ozarkbicycleservice.com > wrote:
> On Oct 11, 10:41 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com"
>
> <pe...@vecchios.com> wrote:
> > Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
> > these days...
>
> >http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>
> Holy rolling feces, Batman, look at dem prices! Almost $50 for a *#
> %^&#*^ Conti sprinter! That's f***ing insane! No wonder almost no one
> uses the damn things anymore.
$50 is a bargain--each example has uniqueness!
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Date: 11 Oct 2007 08:59:22
From: Ozark Bicycle
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for an expensive PIA
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On Oct 11, 10:41 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com"
<pe...@vecchios.com > wrote:
> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
> these days...
>
> http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
Holy rolling feces, Batman, look at dem prices! Almost $50 for a *#
%^&#*^ Conti sprinter! That's f***ing insane! No wonder almost no one
uses the damn things anymore.
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Date: 13 Oct 2007 17:45:19
From: Tom Sherman
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for an expensive PIA
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Ozark Bicycle wrote:
> On Oct 11, 10:41 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com"
> <pe...@vecchios.com> wrote:
>> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
>> these days...
>>
>> http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>
> Holy rolling feces, Batman, look at dem prices! Almost $50 for a *#
> %^&#*^ Conti sprinter! That's f***ing insane! No wonder almost no one
> uses the damn things anymore.
I thought $30 for the 44-406 Avocet slicks I like was steep.
--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
Beer - It's not just for breakfast anymore!
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Date: 11 Oct 2007 09:19:35
From: Tom Nakashima
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for an expensive PIA
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"Ozark Bicycle" <bicycleatelier@ozarkbicycleservice.com > wrote in message
news:1192118362.299378.20460@50g2000hsm.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 11, 10:41 am, "Qui si parla Campagnolo-www.vecchios.com"
> <pe...@vecchios.com> wrote:
>> Just one retailer, showing that the 'tubular' tire is alive and well
>> these days...
>>
>> http://worldclasscycles.com/tubular_tires_free_cart.htm
>
> Holy rolling feces, Batman, look at dem prices! Almost $50 for a *#
> %^&#*^ Conti sprinter! That's f***ing insane! No wonder almost no one
> uses the damn things anymore.
>
>
I never thought the Conti sprinter was a good tire when it was priced
@ $15.99.
I haven't ridden sew-ups for quite a while now, but nothing felt as good
as a worn-in Clement Criterium Seta Silk Tubular. I recall the price about
$27.oo back then. .Hate to see the price if they remade those today.
-tom
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Date: 11 Oct 2007 14:07:19
From: Donald Gillies
Subject: Re: Tubies, just for an expensive PIA
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"Tom Nakashima" <tom@slac.stanford.edu > writes:
>I haven't ridden sew-ups for quite a while now, but nothing felt as good
>as a worn-in Clement Criterium Seta Silk Tubular. I recall the price about
>$27.oo back then. .Hate to see the price if they remade those today.
A. Dugast made silk tubulars until just recently. Only $135-$205/ea.
A. Dugast is out of business now, or so I hear ... maybe it's because
they could never make a tire that cost less than a franklin ..
- Don Gillies
San Diego, CA, USA
P.S. www.worldclasscycles.com still offers A. Dugast silk tubulars.
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