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Main
Date: 24 May 2007 01:42:54
From: Callistus Valerius
Subject: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
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I thought I would give it a try, with the Mirage 9 shifters, and due to
idiosyncratic way that I ride, I have to give them two thumbs down. Isn't
it funny you don't notice something till you actually ride the bike. What I
noticed is there isn't anything to hold on to. I can't be the only one, but
I do a lot of my riding with the heel of my palm against the hood, and wrap
my fingers around the top of a shimano shifter, but guess what the Mirage is
just a bump on the handlebar. Then I saw the new shimano shifters, and
they've grown even bigger, really something to hold on to. Why didn't
someone warn me of this feature? Well I guess I'm stuck, and I do like the
clicking, and I guess I'll to ride on the hoods in the traditional way, but
now I want to perfect the FD. I left the shimano 600 double fd on (it's an
ultegra triple crankset), and it kind of works, but you have to do a lot of
trimming up front, as you move up and down on the cassette. I tried an
ultegra triple fd, that I had, but I couldn't get the low setting low
enough, because it would hit the seat tube. Now if a bought a mirage triple
fd, would that solve the trimming, and low setting problem?
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Date: 28 May 2007 11:04:48
From: Hank Wirtz
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
On May 28, 7:05 am, Paul Kopit <pko...@att.net > wrote:
> On Fri, 25 May 2007 01:51:44 GMT, Michael Press <rub...@pacbell.net>
> wrote:
>
> >I traded out some old narrow banana cutter brake levers for some
> >big fat Tektro aero levers, and am much happier with them. My
> >hands are about average length and width. My weight on the narrow
> >body was not comfortable. The fatter body means my fingers do not
> >wrap around as much when I have to grip and pull under heavy
> >pedaling.
>
> But the rubber on the Tektro levers is awful and rolls around the
> lever and thins fast. I do not know if replacement rubber is
> available.
http://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?sku=16063
$11 at Nashbar, in Gum or Black.
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Date: 25 May 2007 14:50:35
From: Ozark Bicycle
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
On May 25, 4:34 pm, "Crescentius Vespasianus" <jazzyb...@hotmail.com >
wrote:
> > Maybe. They make those lumps so wide that someone with small hands gets
> > problems in the normal position on the hoods. I test rode a bike I build
> > up for a friend and within 15 minutes I got cramps in my hands. I have
> > small hands.
>
> > Lou
>
> ----------
> this is how you do it, heel of the palm against the platform, cup your
> fingers around the top of the shimano shifter.
Not everyone finds that position comfortable.
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Date: 25 May 2007 13:06:17
From: john
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
On May 24, 6:08 pm, "Callistus Valerius" <jazzyb...@hotmail.com >
wrote:
> > One important issue for choosing Shimano or Campy is whether your
> > handposition is comfortable on the hoods. You were dumb enough not to
> > check this before buying them. You are the only one to blame, not the
> > Ergo's/Campy or anybody else. I'm glad Campy didn't take your unusual
> > and dangerous handposition in consideration when designing the hoods, by
> > the way. Then I/we were stuck with lumpy and ugly Shimano clones.
>
> > Lou
>
> -----------
> I've only seen a few bikes with campy shifters, and I live in a cycling
> community, and I have ridden with zillions of riders. So not much
> opportunity to test them out. The few I did spot, it was because of the
> thumb shifter. I brought it up one time, with some riders, and they all
> advised me that the thumb shifter was yesterday stuff. To be fair and
> balanced, I've ridden it a couple of days now, and I like the thumb shifter,
> it's simpler in a way. I like the solid way it feels, and the Shimano kind
> of feels mushy now. But my suspicion on the small hood size has something
> to do with campy cutting weight out of it.
Dear CV
Where do you live? I live in the San Francisco Bay Area & I would
guess that 40% or so of the bikes I see w/ dropped bars are Campy
equipped. Although quite a few have down tube shifters.
Regards, John
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Date: 25 May 2007 21:42:35
From: Crescentius Vespasianus
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
>
> Dear CV
>
> Where do you live? I live in the San Francisco Bay Area & I would
> guess that 40% or so of the bikes I see w/ dropped bars are Campy
> equipped. Although quite a few have down tube shifters.
>
> Regards, John
-------------
Arizona. Nothin' but Shimano for as far as the eye can see.
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Date: 25 May 2007 11:32:06
From: Ozark Bicycle
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
On May 25, 12:30 pm, Lou Holtman <lholremovet...@planet.nl > wrote:
> Callistus Valerius wrote:
> >> One important issue for choosing Shimano or Campy is whether your
> >> handposition is comfortable on the hoods. You were dumb enough not to
> >> check this before buying them. You are the only one to blame, not the
> >> Ergo's/Campy or anybody else. I'm glad Campy didn't take your unusual
> >> and dangerous handposition in consideration when designing the hoods, by
> >> the way. Then I/we were stuck with lumpy and ugly Shimano clones.
>
> >> Lou
> > -----------
> > I've only seen a few bikes with campy shifters, and I live in a cycling
> > community, and I have ridden with zillions of riders. So not much
> > opportunity to test them out. The few I did spot, it was because of the
> > thumb shifter. I brought it up one time, with some riders, and they all
> > advised me that the thumb shifter was yesterday stuff. To be fair and
> > balanced, I've ridden it a couple of days now, and I like the thumb shifter,
> > it's simpler in a way. I like the solid way it feels, and the Shimano kind
> > of feels mushy now. But my suspicion on the small hood size has something
> > to do with campy cutting weight out of it.
>
> I don't thing so. They are comfortable for the position the are designed
> for. With your palm on the hoods is a position that has to be
> discouraged IMO. You can't reach the brakes, you can't shift and in case
> of a unsuspected pothole you can slip over the bar. I always get pissed
> when someone is riding in that position in front of me in a paceline.
>
But that is a position that STI levers, especially the newer designs,
seem to encourage.
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Date: 25 May 2007 21:58:58
From: Lou Holtman
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
Ozark Bicycle wrote:
> On May 25, 12:30 pm, Lou Holtman <lholremovet...@planet.nl> wrote:
>> Callistus Valerius wrote:
>>>> One important issue for choosing Shimano or Campy is whether your
>>>> handposition is comfortable on the hoods. You were dumb enough not to
>>>> check this before buying them. You are the only one to blame, not the
>>>> Ergo's/Campy or anybody else. I'm glad Campy didn't take your unusual
>>>> and dangerous handposition in consideration when designing the hoods, by
>>>> the way. Then I/we were stuck with lumpy and ugly Shimano clones.
>>>> Lou
>>> -----------
>>> I've only seen a few bikes with campy shifters, and I live in a cycling
>>> community, and I have ridden with zillions of riders. So not much
>>> opportunity to test them out. The few I did spot, it was because of the
>>> thumb shifter. I brought it up one time, with some riders, and they all
>>> advised me that the thumb shifter was yesterday stuff. To be fair and
>>> balanced, I've ridden it a couple of days now, and I like the thumb shifter,
>>> it's simpler in a way. I like the solid way it feels, and the Shimano kind
>>> of feels mushy now. But my suspicion on the small hood size has something
>>> to do with campy cutting weight out of it.
>> I don't thing so. They are comfortable for the position the are designed
>> for. With your palm on the hoods is a position that has to be
>> discouraged IMO. You can't reach the brakes, you can't shift and in case
>> of a unsuspected pothole you can slip over the bar. I always get pissed
>> when someone is riding in that position in front of me in a paceline.
>>
>
> But that is a position that STI levers, especially the newer designs,
> seem to encourage.
>
Maybe. They make those lumps so wide that someone with small hands gets
problems in the normal position on the hoods. I test rode a bike I build
up for a friend and within 15 minutes I got cramps in my hands. I have
small hands.
Lou
--
Posted by news://news.nb.nu (http://www.nb.nu)
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| | | |
Date: 25 May 2007 21:34:46
From: Crescentius Vespasianus
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
> Maybe. They make those lumps so wide that someone with small hands gets
> problems in the normal position on the hoods. I test rode a bike I build
> up for a friend and within 15 minutes I got cramps in my hands. I have
> small hands.
>
> Lou
----------
this is how you do it, heel of the palm against the platform, cup your
fingers around the top of the shimano shifter.
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Date: 24 May 2007 08:27:42
From: Ozark Bicycle
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
On May 24, 10:02 am, Lou Holtman <lholremovet...@planet.nl > wrote:
> Callistus Valerius wrote:
> > I thought I would give it a try, with the Mirage 9 shifters, and due to
> > idiosyncratic way that I ride, I have to give them two thumbs down. Isn't
> > it funny you don't notice something till you actually ride the bike. What I
> > noticed is there isn't anything to hold on to. I can't be the only one, but
> > I do a lot of my riding with the heel of my palm against the hood, and wrap
> > my fingers around the top of a shimano shifter, but guess what the Mirage is
> > just a bump on the handlebar. Then I saw the new shimano shifters, and
> > they've grown even bigger, really something to hold on to. Why didn't
> > someone warn me of this feature?
>
> One important issue for choosing Shimano or Campy is whether your
> handposition is comfortable on the hoods. You were dumb enough not to
> check this before buying them. You are the only one to blame, not the
> Ergo's/Campy or anybody else. I'm glad Campy didn't take your unusual
> and dangerous handposition in consideration when designing the hoods, by
> the way. Then I/we were stuck with lumpy and ugly Shimano clones.
>
Hmmm.....there seems to be a kind of dividing line on this aspect of
the STI v Ergo issue. Many of us (n.b., "many", not all) who were
riding prior to the brifter era were already used to conventionally
sized brake hoods and find the STIs lumpy, bulbous, too large, weird,
etc. OTOH, newer riders never really had experience with old style
hoods; many of them find the STI approach more comfortable and find
the Ergos too small, uncomfortable, etc.
Personally, if I ever use brifters (the week after the first blizzard
in Hades!), they will be something more like Ergos, due to the shape
and size.
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Date: 25 May 2007 01:51:44
From: Michael Press
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
In article
<1180020462.319519.300230@m36g2000hse.googlegroups.com >,
Ozark Bicycle <bicycleatelier@ozarkbicycleservice.com > wrote:
> On May 24, 10:02 am, Lou Holtman <lholremovet...@planet.nl> wrote:
> > Callistus Valerius wrote:
> > > I thought I would give it a try, with the Mirage 9 shifters, and due to
> > > idiosyncratic way that I ride, I have to give them two thumbs down. Isn't
> > > it funny you don't notice something till you actually ride the bike. What I
> > > noticed is there isn't anything to hold on to. I can't be the only one, but
> > > I do a lot of my riding with the heel of my palm against the hood, and wrap
> > > my fingers around the top of a shimano shifter, but guess what the Mirage is
> > > just a bump on the handlebar. Then I saw the new shimano shifters, and
> > > they've grown even bigger, really something to hold on to. Why didn't
> > > someone warn me of this feature?
> >
> > One important issue for choosing Shimano or Campy is whether your
> > handposition is comfortable on the hoods. You were dumb enough not to
> > check this before buying them. You are the only one to blame, not the
> > Ergo's/Campy or anybody else. I'm glad Campy didn't take your unusual
> > and dangerous handposition in consideration when designing the hoods, by
> > the way. Then I/we were stuck with lumpy and ugly Shimano clones.
> >
>
> Hmmm.....there seems to be a kind of dividing line on this aspect of
> the STI v Ergo issue. Many of us (n.b., "many", not all) who were
> riding prior to the brifter era were already used to conventionally
> sized brake hoods and find the STIs lumpy, bulbous, too large, weird,
> etc. OTOH, newer riders never really had experience with old style
> hoods; many of them find the STI approach more comfortable and find
> the Ergos too small, uncomfortable, etc.
>
> Personally, if I ever use brifters (the week after the first blizzard
> in Hades!), they will be something more like Ergos, due to the shape
> and size.
I traded out some old narrow banana cutter brake levers for some
big fat Tektro aero levers, and am much happier with them. My
hands are about average length and width. My weight on the narrow
body was not comfortable. The fatter body means my fingers do not
wrap around as much when I have to grip and pull under heavy
pedaling.
--
Michael Press
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| | | |
Date: 28 May 2007 14:05:57
From: Paul Kopit
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
On Fri, 25 May 2007 01:51:44 GMT, Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net >
wrote:
>I traded out some old narrow banana cutter brake levers for some
>big fat Tektro aero levers, and am much happier with them. My
>hands are about average length and width. My weight on the narrow
>body was not comfortable. The fatter body means my fingers do not
>wrap around as much when I have to grip and pull under heavy
>pedaling.
But the rubber on the Tektro levers is awful and rolls around the
lever and thins fast. I do not know if replacement rubber is
available.
|
| | | | |
Date: 29 May 2007 21:25:01
From: Michael Press
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
In article
<kdol53dbtsm54m098u2c7pbd2g5lnp4g9b@4ax.com >,
Paul Kopit <pkopit@att.net > wrote:
> On Fri, 25 May 2007 01:51:44 GMT, Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net>
> wrote:
>
> >I traded out some old narrow banana cutter brake levers for some
> >big fat Tektro aero levers, and am much happier with them. My
> >hands are about average length and width. My weight on the narrow
> >body was not comfortable. The fatter body means my fingers do not
> >wrap around as much when I have to grip and pull under heavy
> >pedaling.
>
> But the rubber on the Tektro levers is awful and rolls around the
> lever and thins fast. I do not know if replacement rubber is
> available.
These are stamped R100 and 04. I assume that means made
in 2004. The rubber is tight. It does not roll _at_
_all_. The rubber on the replaced Weinmann levers dose
roll a bit.
--
Michael Press
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| |
Date: 24 May 2007 17:02:25
From: Lou Holtman
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
Callistus Valerius wrote:
> I thought I would give it a try, with the Mirage 9 shifters, and due to
> idiosyncratic way that I ride, I have to give them two thumbs down. Isn't
> it funny you don't notice something till you actually ride the bike. What I
> noticed is there isn't anything to hold on to. I can't be the only one, but
> I do a lot of my riding with the heel of my palm against the hood, and wrap
> my fingers around the top of a shimano shifter, but guess what the Mirage is
> just a bump on the handlebar. Then I saw the new shimano shifters, and
> they've grown even bigger, really something to hold on to. Why didn't
> someone warn me of this feature?
One important issue for choosing Shimano or Campy is whether your
handposition is comfortable on the hoods. You were dumb enough not to
check this before buying them. You are the only one to blame, not the
Ergo's/Campy or anybody else. I'm glad Campy didn't take your unusual
and dangerous handposition in consideration when designing the hoods, by
the way. Then I/we were stuck with lumpy and ugly Shimano clones.
Lou
--
Posted by news://news.nb.nu (http://www.nb.nu)
|
| | |
Date: 25 May 2007 01:08:03
From: Callistus Valerius
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
> One important issue for choosing Shimano or Campy is whether your
> handposition is comfortable on the hoods. You were dumb enough not to
> check this before buying them. You are the only one to blame, not the
> Ergo's/Campy or anybody else. I'm glad Campy didn't take your unusual
> and dangerous handposition in consideration when designing the hoods, by
> the way. Then I/we were stuck with lumpy and ugly Shimano clones.
>
>
> Lou
-----------
I've only seen a few bikes with campy shifters, and I live in a cycling
community, and I have ridden with zillions of riders. So not much
opportunity to test them out. The few I did spot, it was because of the
thumb shifter. I brought it up one time, with some riders, and they all
advised me that the thumb shifter was yesterday stuff. To be fair and
balanced, I've ridden it a couple of days now, and I like the thumb shifter,
it's simpler in a way. I like the solid way it feels, and the Shimano kind
of feels mushy now. But my suspicion on the small hood size has something
to do with campy cutting weight out of it.
|
| | | |
Date: 25 May 2007 19:30:30
From: Lou Holtman
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
Callistus Valerius wrote:
>> One important issue for choosing Shimano or Campy is whether your
>> handposition is comfortable on the hoods. You were dumb enough not to
>> check this before buying them. You are the only one to blame, not the
>> Ergo's/Campy or anybody else. I'm glad Campy didn't take your unusual
>> and dangerous handposition in consideration when designing the hoods, by
>> the way. Then I/we were stuck with lumpy and ugly Shimano clones.
>>
>>
>> Lou
> -----------
> I've only seen a few bikes with campy shifters, and I live in a cycling
> community, and I have ridden with zillions of riders. So not much
> opportunity to test them out. The few I did spot, it was because of the
> thumb shifter. I brought it up one time, with some riders, and they all
> advised me that the thumb shifter was yesterday stuff. To be fair and
> balanced, I've ridden it a couple of days now, and I like the thumb shifter,
> it's simpler in a way. I like the solid way it feels, and the Shimano kind
> of feels mushy now. But my suspicion on the small hood size has something
> to do with campy cutting weight out of it.
I don't thing so. They are comfortable for the position the are designed
for. With your palm on the hoods is a position that has to be
discouraged IMO. You can't reach the brakes, you can't shift and in case
of a unsuspected pothole you can slip over the bar. I always get pissed
when someone is riding in that position in front of me in a paceline.
Lou
--
Posted by news://news.nb.nu (http://www.nb.nu)
|
| |
Date: 24 May 2007 07:33:28
From: D'ohBoy
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
On May 24, 7:42 am, Qui si parla Campagnolo <p...@vecchios.com > wrote,
in part:
> I'm sure you can get some shimano shifters...for lots more
> money, sure, and maybe they will fail, but they sure feel nice.
Maybe feel nice to some... gave up on Shimano due to comfort issues
(and the extremely poor triple shifting with second gen 105 - what POS
those were)....
D'ohBoy
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Date: 24 May 2007 14:54:16
From: Clive George
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
"Callistus Valerius" <jazzyboss@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:y465i.9610$296.8256@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> I thought I would give it a try, with the Mirage 9 shifters, and due to
> idiosyncratic way that I ride, I have to give them two thumbs down. Isn't
> it funny you don't notice something till you actually ride the bike. What
> I
> noticed is there isn't anything to hold on to. I can't be the only one,
> but
> I do a lot of my riding with the heel of my palm against the hood, and
> wrap
> my fingers around the top of a shimano shifter, but guess what the Mirage
> is
> just a bump on the handlebar. Then I saw the new shimano shifters, and
> they've grown even bigger, really something to hold on to. Why didn't
> someone warn me of this feature?
I ride ergos with the palm on the hood, fingers over the top - sems fine to
me :-)
cheers,
clive
|
| | |
Date: 24 May 2007 18:52:48
From: Tim McTeague
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
"Clive George" <clive@xxxx-x.fsnet.co.uk > wrote in message
news:46559930$0$8725$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader02.plus.net...
> "Callistus Valerius" <jazzyboss@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:y465i.9610$296.8256@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net...
>> I thought I would give it a try, with the Mirage 9 shifters, and due
>> to
>> idiosyncratic way that I ride, I have to give them two thumbs down.
>> Isn't
>> it funny you don't notice something till you actually ride the bike.
>> What I
>> noticed is there isn't anything to hold on to. I can't be the only one,
>> but
>> I do a lot of my riding with the heel of my palm against the hood, and
>> wrap
>> my fingers around the top of a shimano shifter, but guess what the Mirage
>> is
>> just a bump on the handlebar. Then I saw the new shimano shifters, and
>> they've grown even bigger, really something to hold on to. Why didn't
>> someone warn me of this feature?
>
> I ride ergos with the palm on the hood, fingers over the top - sems fine
> to me :-)
>
> cheers,
> clive
Me too. I find using bars such as the Deda Newton help matters. They make
for a nice transition from bar to Ergo. The Dura-Ace ones always made my
hands go numb.
Tim McTeague
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Date: 24 May 2007 21:52:48
From: Crescentius Vespasianus
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
>
> I ride ergos with the palm on the hood, fingers over the top - sems fine
to
> me :-)
>
> cheers,
> clive
------------
I just found that position, with the little bump in the middle of the
palm, and the fingers draped over the front. That gives you a different
position, but it still isn't as good as the Shimano. I'd love to get a hold
of some of the new shimanos, levers as big as rulers, huge platforms to put
your hands on, they're awesome.
|
| |
Date: 24 May 2007 05:42:17
From: Qui si parla Campagnolo
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
On May 23, 7:42 pm, "Callistus Valerius" <jazzyb...@hotmail.com >
wrote:
> I thought I would give it a try, with the Mirage 9 shifters, and due to
> idiosyncratic way that I ride, I have to give them two thumbs down. Isn't
> it funny you don't notice something till you actually ride the bike. What I
> noticed is there isn't anything to hold on to. I can't be the only one, but
> I do a lot of my riding with the heel of my palm against the hood, and wrap
> my fingers around the top of a shimano shifter, but guess what the Mirage is
> just a bump on the handlebar. Then I saw the new shimano shifters, and
> they've grown even bigger, really something to hold on to. Why didn't
> someone warn me of this feature?
Why didn't you go look at a bike with Campag shifters first?
Well I guess I'm stuck, and I do like the
> clicking, and I guess I'll to ride on the hoods in the traditional way, but
> now I want to perfect the FD. I left the shimano 600 double fd on (it's an
> ultegra triple crankset), and it kind of works, but you have to do a lot of
> trimming up front, as you move up and down on the cassette. I tried an
> ultegra triple fd, that I had, but I couldn't get the low setting low
> enough, because it would hit the seat tube. Now if a bought a mirage triple
> fd, would that solve the trimming, and low setting problem?
The inner travel problem certainly. Put the things on ebay and be done
with it. I'm sure you can get some shimano shifters...for lots more
money, sure, and maybe they will fail, but they sure feel nice.
|
| |
Date: 24 May 2007 06:32:08
From: Ryan Cousineau
Subject: Re: thumbs down on Campagnolo shifter....
|
In article <y465i.9610$296.8256@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net >,
"Callistus Valerius" <jazzyboss@hotmail.com > wrote:
> I thought I would give it a try, with the Mirage 9 shifters, and due to
> idiosyncratic way that I ride, I have to give them two thumbs down. Isn't
> it funny you don't notice something till you actually ride the bike. What I
> noticed is there isn't anything to hold on to. I can't be the only one, but
> I do a lot of my riding with the heel of my palm against the hood, and wrap
> my fingers around the top of a shimano shifter, but guess what the Mirage is
> just a bump on the handlebar. Then I saw the new shimano shifters, and
> they've grown even bigger, really something to hold on to. Why didn't
> someone warn me of this feature? Well I guess I'm stuck, and I do like the
> clicking, and I guess I'll to ride on the hoods in the traditional way, but
> now I want to perfect the FD. I left the shimano 600 double fd on (it's an
> ultegra triple crankset), and it kind of works, but you have to do a lot of
> trimming up front, as you move up and down on the cassette. I tried an
> ultegra triple fd, that I had, but I couldn't get the low setting low
> enough, because it would hit the seat tube. Now if a bought a mirage triple
> fd, would that solve the trimming, and low setting problem?
Hey Callistus, are you serious about your dissatisfaction with the
Mirage 9s? Because if so, I am ready to relieve you of this problem on
reasonably generous terms!
No, seriously, I'll buy your shifters. My email address is real, call me
[makes that phone-pantomime gesture].
--
Ryan Cousineau rcousine@sfu.ca http://www.wiredcola.com/
"I don't want kids who are thinking about going into mathematics
to think that they have to take drugs to succeed." -Paul Erdos
|
|
